Capital Punishment in Japan


The most recent executions were carried out last August of three men who were found guilty of multiple murders and robbery.
The following description from Wikipedia - turn away if you don't want the details.
Executions are carried out by hanging in a death chamber within the Detention Centre. When a death order has been issued, the condemned prisoner is informed in the morning of his or her execution. The condemned is given their choice of the last meal.I've heard in the past things like "kill the murders - why should tax payers fork out to keep them alive." Also heard that there are many human rights movements to get rid of capital punishment.
The prisoner's family and legal representatives are never informed until afterwards. Consequently, there is no possibility of a final meeting.
Before the condemned prisoner is blindfolded, he or she is allowed to leave a last message if he or she so wishes, then led to the death chamber. The noose is put in place and the prisoner's knees tied together. The trap-door of the gallows is operated remotely from a separate room: three to five selected prison officers each press a switch, only one of which is wired to the trap-door release.
Afterwards, the prisoner's family is informed the execution has occurred and they may collect the body. A brief notice of the execution is issued to the media but the identity of the prisoner is withheld – it will only become publicly known if the family chooses to inform the media.
Does your region carry out capital punishment and do you agree? I know that electrocutions are carried out but not sure where.
Hanged Elmo by quasarsglow@Flickr.
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we dont have capital punishment here in germany...
it's not right to do things like that i guess...
Otaku
http://animenmanga.com
I think capital punishment should be enforced by everyone for first degree murderers. If you are sick and twisted in a way that makes you to take another human life, you don't deserve to keep on living.
Storm Rider
Capital punishment still exists here in Singapore, though most of the cases where capital punishment was meted out were rather highly publicized media affairs...no chance of anonymity for the condemned criminal...
Dropping computers, starting all over again at Journalism
http://xspblog.com
Doesn't happen here in Brazil, but we shure needed it.
Catholic country, never gonna happen.
But not only capital punishment... we plain need more effective laws against criminals.
People who needs to be arrested here aren't, and poor people that ends up commiting crimes because there's no other option left (apart from dying from hunger), will not rarely get unfair prison times, and harsh treatment.
Problem is, I can't see this getting any better. Politicians gives the example. It's not an unreal estimate that over 50% of our politicians are involved somehow on corruption related crimes, or crimes against the brazilian people.
Not only that, but most of these criminals are never punished, even after being caught.
I'd love to have capital punishment to those.
Student
Personally, I believe politicians all over the world are hardly completely clean if they hold their post for more than 5 years or so. Well, just what I think.
I support capital punishment really but the problem is that would the people even execute it on the right ones. Like you say, it's a problem because those who are supposed to be caught aren't. If that's the case, even if there are capital punishments, it wouldn't really help.
hobo
I definitely agree that capital punishment in M'sia is not carried out on some of the really, really, really wrong ones. But then, i have to say 'no' to it. It's the same as murder, the only difference is that it's carried out by the government/administration. Think on that.
Graphic Designer
In the US the state Texas has the highest percentage of Catholics in the country yet Texas is the most active state in carrying out executions. I find it very confusing as to why and always thought it should be the other way around.
student
http://jk-pictureaweek.blogspot.com/
ooh singapore is heavy on laws !! they got alot of capital punishment ... like murdering 1 person, trafficing drugs both can lead to death
anime/cosplay events organizer
http://www.cosplay.ph
afaik, capital punishment is still being used here through lethal injection. condemned prisoners are strapped to the "death bed" and a lethal dose of a deadly chemical is injected to the blood stream. it's a slow and less painful death.
there are some human rights group who are working to abolish capital punishment
@XSportSeeker
the philippines is a catholic country and yet we still practice capital punishment
Itinerant Philosopher, Erstwhile Minion
http://l33tminion.livejournal.com/
Capital punishment may be just in some cases, but the cost of applying it to someone who is innocent is incredibly high. I don't think there's a justice system in the world accurate / cautious enough to support it.
student
http://animesugoi.animeblogger.net/
We do have death sentences, though thats only in a few states. The method generally used now is through toxins. Interesting how Japan still uses hanging as a form of death.
University's Slave
You'd be surprised how many states actually do have capital punishment. *double checks via google* Only fifteen states officially don't have it from the look of it. Yikes. Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:US_death_penalty_methods.svg
Sophist
http://www.techswe.com
Capital punishment is fine with me. However, the world has become so overly wrapped in the human condition and namby-pamby that we will baby ourselves to death eventually.
大学生
http://the1iam.blogspot.com/
A lot of countries in Asia still practice capital punishment while many western countries have abolished it.
銀河帝国五〇一軍团 TK/TD 8316 M.E.P.D. Police Sergeant
http://gordonator.com/
yes capital punishment is legal in singapore.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_punishment_in_singapore
well that is assuming kira doesn't get him first.
Service desk support
http://lookingglass.kokidokom.net
I've known that Japan has capital punishment, but it isn't widely practiced over there. In fact, I read that the previous chief Judge in japan was against it so very very few death sentences were handed out for a while because of that belief.
The UK doesn't have the death sentence, but then we're having problems with overcrowding in prisons, more lenient sentences for crimes and a slowly increasing crime rate!
I don't know if I'm for capital punishment, but I do understand the arguments for, moreso that the arguments against.
VF-25 Pilot. Universariate Scholar.
capital punishment is indeed legal in malaysia. it applies to serious crimes such as drug smuggling and murder.
IMO capital punishment is needed for some of the more severe crimes. a murderer certainly deserves death and i dont understand how a jail term would be enough to punish a person who has committed such a terrible crime. but thats just me.
Student
http://saikyou.wordpress.com
Here in Singapore, quite a number of crime will lead to hanging: possession(usage?) of firearms, kidnapping(whoever attempt this in Singapore is downright insane) or even possession of 15 g of heroin.
security/3d graphic artist
http://www.kennethleishman.com/
here in the us alot of states still do have capital punishment.. although some states just haven't done so in awhile.. while texas has put in a fast lane :D
usually lethal injection here.. but in some states you have a choice.. and in utah.. you have 4.. hanging, electric chair, lethal injection, or a firing squad.. you pick..
i belive in it since the most violent offender won't be rehabilitated so.. go ahead..
Visual Communications and Web 2.0
http://www.imagineboris.com
In USA some states have it and some don't The DC sniper was sentences to death, but for the most part its lethal injection. In Belarus (where I was born and lived for 14 years) we had capital punishment for series crimes that are extremely evil. I personally believe in capital punishment because "life is a gift, and those that take it away! why should they keep this gift?"
University English Teacher
http://www.japantech.info
I approve wholeheartedly of capital punishment. In fact, I would go on to say it isn't used enough. Far too much money is waste keeping people in jail. There are two solutions for this - decreasing prison time for victimless crimes - like drug possession etc, and increasing the amount of capital punishment. Why do we let child abusers live?
Just another reason I hate England, the only capital punishment we have is for treason!! What a joke!
Increasing capital punishment in Japan would have the added bonus of decreasing the severe overpopulation. Wouldnt we all like an apartment thats a little bit bigger?!?! (=semi serious)
Web Designer
http://www.cyworkwork.com
Capital punishment is legal in Malaysia too.
3D artist- Codemasters KL
You know what i think would be a better overall punishment?
Getting what you did to others unto yourself. Like, if you commit murder and dismembered the corpse, you'll be dismembered alive. Rapist will have their "ahem" cut off. Drivers who did hit-and-run will be run over by a car.
Robbers, thief will have one of their limbs broken.
I believe such rules would be very effective in curbing crimes, even though they're extreme. >_
Programmer Trainee
http://jointsareokay.blogspot.com
That's actually an interesting idea.
Sick...but interesting.
I agree with the rapist idea..or get them pregnant with vampire babies.
NEET (no, student, AND employed min. wage)
http://otterhangar.blogspot.com/
wow, Japan hangs people? Did not know that... In America you can choose!
a.) lethal injection
b.) hanging
c.) electrecution
d.) gas
e.) firing squad (yes, in some state it still is)
and to my opinion, I say, whatever. Punishment is needed, but what is the proper punishment for taking someone's life?
I think that peple who commited violent offenses should just be deployed by the military's frontline soldiers, who are the first to die (like, mortality rate of 90% or more type situations).
Ship welder, IT Guy, Rotary Fanatic
sending them to the frontlinei s just more inhumane.
I didnt know the japanese didnt have a choice in the death sentence.
You would think the most technological superior country would atleast have something else then the hanging from centuries ago. Atleast use lethal injection.
I support capital punishment to its fullest. If you did something horrid, such as multiple murders, first degree murders or something along that line, then you need to die plain and simple.
BioResearch Assistant
As far as firing squads, only one of the line up carries a live round in the chamber while the others have blanks so it will not be known who is responsible for the execution.
Lethal injection is the more preferred method of execution. It is also illegal I believe for the the prisoner to feel any pain, rather a human rights investigation will be conducted if any evidence of that is seen.
Self-employed
http://sparechangeanyone.wordpress.com/
I had no idea cap punishment was still goin on in so many places.
On a (much) lighter note, that picture of elmo is crackin me up ^^;
Web Design & Development
http://www.nerdculture.org
I'm not against Capital Punishment--rather I'm against the misuse of it. It should only be used when a criminal is beyond help. Many criminals are capable of recorvery, but some are just too far gone to even try.
Student
http://marianto.deviantart.com/
Yeap.. Singpaore is the same as Japan.
But one thing special about Singapore is that we impose caning too.
More info here ==> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caning_in_Singapore
If you don't want your butt to bleed, Don't commit crimes in Singapore.
University Student
still hang in malaysia
Student
http://animestuff.wordpress.com/
As you know Danny, capital punishment in Europe is forbidden.
=.=!
http://hihi123.wordpress.com
i don't see much of a seriouness if they were to really recevie the capital punishment.. it's really too cheap for them..
Physics student
I'm from Spain (which got accepted in the European Union in the 1980's) and one of the requirements for a country to become a member of the EU is to respect all human rights (no torture, no death penalty, etc...) I personally believe that death penalty is fair in some situations... but since there is always a margin for mistakes (In the US, 1 in every 3 prisioners condemned to death penalty is found innocent afterwards) I think that the ultimate punishment should be be held in uncommunicated jail for life (come on, this is really even worst than death) What I really hate from the Spanish Law System is that a prisioner cannot be in jail for more than 30 years!!! So no matter what you did and how many years they give you (a murder is 100 years, a terrorist can get 1000 or 2000 years in Spain) you will be free after 30 years...
引きこもり
私は死刑賛成な人、まぁ「全ての人が更正できるとは思えない」とか「死ぬまで牢屋の中に入れるとか意味が有るとは思えない」とか「社会が受け入れられ無い人は死ぬしかない」とかその辺りが理由。(日本の)死刑反対派の人がよく言う「先進国で死刑制度が残っている国は殆ど無い」って主張が受け容れられないのもありますけど。(だから何?って感じです。ハイ)
余談だけど、ハリウッド版「ドラゴンボール」の役者募集は解り易いB級狙いで笑えました。
.NET/Web Developer
http://scrumptious.animeblogger.net
what wendigo said. totally against it.
student
aaaaa! capital punishment= evilness!
kinda seems like a slow way to die... well, i'm not gonna do any crimes in the first place so i guess if i ever move to japan i won't need to worry about it!
Actually, hanging is a very quick method of executing someone as long as its done properly. Hanging is interpreted as choking the person to death when it is really meant to snap there neck. If the neck doesn't break it means they didn't do it right. The most common reason is because they didn't fall far enough to create enough force on the neck to break. If anyone has seen the leaked video of Saddam being executed should see that is a proper hanging.
Student Engineer
http://www.tgwnetohh.blogspot.com/
I just couldn't vote in this poll because I am "completely" on the fence about it.
My belief and my desire to show some mercy fight with each other on whether criminals should be executed or forgiven. Of course someone will have to serve their time for life: that is their punishment for whatever hanous crimes they committed.
Unfortunatly the big guy upstairs in this case does not disapprove of capital punishment, so despite what I think it has to continue. I am a big supporter of human rights, but compared to the big hombre my opinion means nothing.
Hanging isn't as bad as most people say it is. I hate to sound sick with this, but depending on the quality of the noose and the proper counter weights and balances, the neck will break quicker, thus the condemned will die a quicker death.
The USA uses a couple of methods but prefers to use lethal injection to stop the heart and breathing of the condemned. Sometimes this process has gone horribly wrong and the condemned have been in intense pain, human rights activists will say that is totally wrong but again the guy (or girl) is about to die... I think we got rid of the electric chair quite a few years ago but the "gas chamber" I believe is still in use. I am not sure on this one either but I think that the firing squad has also been discontinued.
So yeah, I am on the fence on that one. In my opinion that saying that taxpayers claim is from a source of greed and hate. Perhaps capital punishment should be reserved for the most haneous of criminals.
Tow dispatcher
Like -XYZPDQ, I'm riding the fence on this one. I don't disapprove of capital punishment. I disapprove of certain capital punishment such as the firing squad, the electric chair, and hangings. In my personal opinion, that's unhumane whereas I consider lethal injection humane.
Aeronautical Engineer
http://www.deranged-minds.com/blog/
Capital punishment is no longer practised in the UK but oddly enough, there are still some laws in the country for capital punishment which haven't rightly been officially abolished yet.
I know assassination of the monarchy will by English law lead to a death sentence. Damn those lazy politicians... =P
Non-profit org. volunteering work addict
First of all, please forgive my choice of words here.
I agree with japantech.info and Guarayakha in that some criminals have an easy life compared to the permanent scars they caused to their victims.
Some of them even have golden cells with TV and stuff like that... Where is Blind Justice when we truly need her?
Yes, the best way to calm a rapist down is to cut his (beep!) and a scammer to pay people back until he runs out of energy.
I am not for death penalty, since it is not proportionate to the damage that was done. I would prefer to see those outlaws working and working until they understand how life can be hard and cruel (no physical or moral torture though)... Then they may learn something.
"Death is too good for you" I would say as a conclusion.
Really.
Chemistry Student
http://www.akibakeicordoba.com
Absolutely I dont approve capital punishment, the State beings a murder doing that
High School Student, College student, Part-time Ninja
http://random-asian.blogspot.com/
Use the 'equivalent exchange' as punishment.
If you took an eye, you lose an eye.
If you kill some one, you serve life in prison.
If you kill more than one, you get genetically manipulated to serve out several life time in prison.
student
http://jk-pictureaweek.blogspot.com/
alright heres a video about capital punishment in singapore. We have the highest per capita rate of death punishment in the world. They have killed total of 400 in the last 13 year .. compaired to your 3 million locals.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K0Ltn4_cSHk
Student
Capital Punishment imo isn't very "cool." Also...I find it a bit odd how the Japanese government still uses hanging as a method for killing someone. I never really thought of it, but I sorta expected something like lethal injection? Also...for the last meal...you can have ANYTHING???
sleepyhead
I wish we had capital punishment.
Dutch law is to soft.
If you kill someone, you just get a few years and rehab.
Thats it.
Then you are free to kill again.
NEET
Same in Sweden, the laws are too soft.
In Sweden the longest imprisonment is like 10-20 years.
QA Engineer, Postgraduate Student
http://www.thelifeeffect.net
I am firmly against capital punishment, which is probably due to my education as well as the arguments I have heard for and against it.
Pro-DP arguments seem to be based on Hammurabi-style morality and appeals to emotion, the former outdated, the latter a falacy.
In secondary school, when I was 14, we had a Constitutional Law class, which has served me well (indeed, I think all secondary school should teach that subject early on). We had one two-hour class one day, about why the Death Penalty was not legal in Argentina (granted, many military governments have executed dissenters, but they had to act outside the law for that).
Basically, after the 1810 revolution, the Assembly of 1813 declared a number of punishments used by the former Spanish rulers to be inhuman. Among these were torture and the death penalty, which were considered equally unjust (they also made slavery illegal). Later on, this was enshrined in our Penal Code.
The arguments against the Death Penalty are manifold, and they were presented to me all those years ago. For instance, in many many cases, people are executed unfairly, which is only discovered later on, when it is too late. This happens way more often than people think, and I don't believe in the theory that some innocents must die so that the guilty can be punished.
All that said, I find some of what you posted interesting, Danny. Mainly, the bit about the execution system: to avoid the policemen to feel like executioners, they never know who actually killed the prisoner.
BioResearch Assistant
The justice system isn't perfect, true. There was a story here in the states where a prisoner convicted of a murder 25yrs or so years ago was exonerated through DNA evidence. He had an alibi and pleaded not guilty all those years while in jail only to have it found out so many years later he was right.
NEET
I'm for it as long as the defendant is 100% proven of guilt, has no remorse, and is extremely dangerous and can re-offend.
The more heinous it is, the more they deserve it. I don't consider heinous criminals to be humans anymore. Sounds harsh, but where is the justice for the victims?
I completely agree with Shippo's comment. I believe in capital punishment if the defendant is guilty beyond the point of any reasonable dispute, a non-reformable threat to society, and/or have committed heinous crimes such as the deaths of many people. I would even go so far as to include things like high treason as a reason to sentence someone to death, however I would much rather deport/ban said individual from the country for life unless they have committed a crime that blatently jeopardized national security or directly lead to the demise of numerous citizens of the involved state.
Non-profit org. volunteering work addict
mad n1nja and JaydenM... true indeed.
Like I said before, some are relatively unpunished for their crimes and that is one of the reasons why violence and criminality still plague our world without rest.
Student
I don't care how bad the person is.
It's really not our place to decide who lives or died. Period.
Student
oh... kind of like how Timothy Leary got 30 years for possession of half a joint.
Govt. Officer
we got capital punishmnet in malaysia in the form of hanging..till death..there's a special squad that executes all the hanging at all the prisons in Malaysia..
Hikikomori in the making
http://supermariabros.deviantart.com/
I can't really answer the question, coz' I'm dumb and don't really know much... But I think capital punishment should only be for those who commits serious crimes, like murder... Here in Singapore, people who are senteced to be hanged will be granted to eat any dish they want, sounds weird? Yea, I don't even know if this is real...
Otaku
http://imperiomoe.wordpress.com
I against the capital punishment In a Nutshell.
The capital punishment has been used more against poor, religious, ethnic minorities, and politics opponents.
The capital punishment did not reduce the criminality as supporters said
The capital punishment is more expensive than keep the prisoners alive.
There are always a possibility to kill a innocent.
The message is lets kill to show killing is bad.
More info
http://web.amnesty.org/library/Index/ENGACT500012000?open&of=ENG-392
http://www.amnesty.ca/deathpenalty/canada.php
http://www.deathpenalty.org/index.php?pid=cost&menu=1%22
http://www-tech.mit.edu/V113/N53/morrison.53o.html
http://www.religioustolerance.org/execut4.htm
Fresh Diploma Grad... enlisted.. Cpl soon I hope...
http://splifearts.com
It worked in Singapore. Effectively stopping all Kidnapping cases and hiked the price of Drugs in Singapore to an almost impossible price.
So don't say it didn't work.
Whereas, how CP is mere out should be controlled.
Programmer Trainee
http://jointsareokay.blogspot.com
I guess it depends on the culture of a country.
Capital Punishment isn't for everyone
Grocery Store Clerk
Part of me his for and against capital punishment.
There are instances when it had been used improperly here in the US.
There are some istances where crimals deserve it such as:
War Criminal
Mass (Seriel) Killers
Terrorist
Traitors
Student
I think a few states like Texas still perform capital punishment and I don't think it is a good idea.
1. They don't kill them right away, the prisoners are kept for a long time before being killed so the tax money to keep them alive is still being used.
2. There have been a lot of incidents when a person is convicted and sentenced to death, then a few years after they have been executed, some new evidence pops up that shows that they were innocent.
3. Killing someone to punish them for killing someone seems silly to me
dannychoo.com の読者
lets forgive and forget...
will there ever be peace in this world if we keep revenging
IT Crowd
I second that.
For all those who say killing is okay for punishment, then could you look into their eyes as you did the deed yourself??
Office Administrator
http://aquilla429.co.uk
Would you like to sit a tell a grieving mother and father to just 'forgive and forget' the murderer who killed her beloved 19 year old son who was her only child?
The victims and families of victims will never be able to forgive the criminal that killed or raped their relatives or friends and they could never forget it because it becomes a part of your life you can't let go.
Forgive and forget is easy to say when it doesn't effect you, but if someone killed your mother, would you be able to stand up in court and say 'it's ok, lets just forgive and forget'. I don't think you would.
IT Crowd
Forgive? I hope I could. Forget - I never would....
conscript
from reading some of the comments I noticed that it seems that some sees punishment as revenge. however, I personally feel that punishment and revenge are two different things. punishment could or actually serve as a form of detterent, to put it "nicely", an encouragement for proper behaviour.
while I do not disapprove of capital punishment, neither do I really support the use of capital punishment.
oh, and something I learnt from the people who punished me, "arn't you asking for it when you get punished for doing something that you know would get you punished?"
Grocery Store Clerk
For those of you that know about major event happening in Japan. Who can remember the Saran gas attack on Tokyo Metro. Shoko Asahara (the leader of attack)desires worse than a lethel injection. He should get the Old Sparky (the electric chair).
I'd rather have a criminal spend the rest of his life in jail than get out of it by being killed.
Future Pioneer - U.S. Airman
Some people don’t change. That’s why we invented prisons and the death penalty.
escape artist
Some parts of U.S.A. still have the death penalty and typically its electrocution or lethal injection. I personally believe the ultimate punishment is having to live out your life as a caged "animal" prisoners find ways to kill themselves all the time anyway.. I really think hanging is way too violent a method but this IS Japan we're talking about, ritualistic suicide by cutting open ones stomach was common in the past, so doesn't really surprise me all that much i suppose.
Close-protection officer/Martial artist
A lot of parts still have the death penalty actually, and some still have hanging, and further still two that still use firing squads. Yep, the USA still has bizarre law books. ^^; Still trying to find out where it's legal to execute prisoners via lethal dose of bacon, because that's where I'll be moving to. :P
former Emperor of Britannia
http://reflectiarx.wordpress.com/
For me capital punishment should be given to those prisoners who have claimed lives purposely.
Student
http://www.joesblog.jp
We don't have it in the UK and im glad we don't.
an eye for an eye and the whole world goes blind...
Programming Student
http://greendiscord.blogspot.com/
ooh its almost the same how it goes here. i'd say its wrong but i approve lol! but keeping them alive is much better, they'd suffer more than just instant death for what they did.
Com. Sci. Student
here in our country the only heavy punishment is reclusion perpetua... death penalty was lifted because of religion (Catholics) no offense...
To the people against the death penelty:
So that guy who kidnapped that 9 year old from her own bedroom, raped her then buried her alive should live by our tax money? Prisoners have cable tv, video game systems and education. Some of us can barely, if not afford that! It's pretty obvious if there is an enforced death penalty and strict laws, there will be less crime.
Here where I live (Phila), cops are being gunned down more then ever in the last 6 months and it's becoming a dirty ghetto. Corrupt law enforcement, governor.
People say "It's cruel to kill" then say "Let them live with the guilt". Now does that make sense?
Death penalty all the way. No wonder Japan has such little crime.
Light Yagami for president >_< lol
Mad scientist
I see attacks on law enforcement as a serious crime. If we can't protect the police then people will not work in the policeforce anymore. The law will stop working and gangs will rule without police. I say shoot everybody who attacks the police. The same goes for corrupt people in the police force.
Lately (within the last 10 years or so) I have noticed that certain kind of people will constantly do the opposite of the what the police wants them to do. A uniform used to mean that nobody would do that person anything but now it seems like people target the uniform for the sole purpose of attacking the system. I think it's obscene that the law will not jail people for saying stuff like "suck my dolphin" to the police >.<
A Real RocknRolla
it makes sense because YOU ARE NOT GOD. you become the same scum you want to kill! tell me something. ever since you have capital punishment, harsher laws etc. has ANYTHING changed? it has crime in the US is on the RISE. what must change is something else.
Mad scientist
Maybe it countered an even bigger increase in crime.
I see a strong law enforcement force as the only option to battle current criminals in the short run and keep order. In the long run it's the laws that should make a situation where crime doesn't pay. As long as there is money to earn fast with little or no risk, then people will do it. If you take away the marked then you decrease their income. If the police is strong enough, then the risk increases.
I wouldn't sit in Slovenia telling how to deal with criminal elements. After EU added Eastern Europe then crime in "the old countries" increased quite a lot because the mafia from the east shows up with organized crime. We now have a problem with gangs breaking into houses and stealing stuff. We had that before, but the difference is that if they meet somebody they will kill them. This never happened before. Sometimes they even break in while they know that there are people in the house so they plan to murder them even before they enter the house.
A Real RocknRolla
no it didn't counter anything! aren't you listening? the crimes they are punishing with capital punishment is RISING. it solves nothing! it was an idea that the fear of death would make them stop! it doesn't and it never will! its rising like mad because of the world we live in. have you ever asked your self why was the crime committed? why that man went and robed that house? maybe he didn't have a choice? that he was starving and couldn't get a job because they think he is less then the people he lives with? i am talking about how the Muslims and other foreigners had and are having problems in France with jobs. some have no choice. crime is their only way to survive. some of us where born in privilege and never will understand what its like to not eat for days. not being able to feed your family.
you have to fix the source of the problem not destroy its effects. if you where sick and where coughing and your throat hurts do you only drink cough syrup or do you eat antibiotics to attack the source of the problem? its the same. we need to fix the source of the problem not its effects.
And the issue of your tax money going to people who did wrong? How would you feel knowing you're hard earned money was going to someone like Scott Peterson? I see you're a student.....and a weed promoter? Is weed cheap even? <.< I wish I could afford college.
The U.S.' death penalties are a joke anyway, some people are on death row for 30 years. Most die from old age. I think you'd have to come to Philly to see how horrible it's becoming and hear the news of yet another cop being gunned down =/
Sorry, missed this part. Need an edit button =S
"have you ever asked your self why was the crime committed?"
Raping, child rape - He was horny?
There ARE differences between criminally insane and just plan evil (Scott Peterson).
NEET
That case sounds quite brutally.
Maybe he deserve Capital Punishment maybe not. It depends on if he is a general threat for the society.
All round good guy and musician
Capital punishment seems to work in Japan, whether you agree with it or not.
The Japanese legal system seems to be very thorough before convicting anyone to death. Whereas, I do not have the same confidence in our own judicial system. Perhaps it is a case of my being a resident here un the UK that I see more faults in our ststem, so I am willing to admit that I might be wrong.
I do belive that the piunishment should fit the crime, and that the guilty should lose their privilages accordingly. However, in this country, it seems to me that the prisoner can have more luxuries laid on for them by the taxpayer, than the poor victims are able to provide themselves.
I shall end here, or I run the risk of turning this expression of opinion into a two-hour lecture!! lol
Office Administrator
http://aquilla429.co.uk
I'm not sure about a death sentence. You get some people who continuously abuse innocent children, or they rape several women and even people who commit mass murders or tortures. UK Law doesn't let a person be locked up for life, but some people who go into prison are NEVER going to change. Many child abusers and rapists will re offend once out of prison and its not completely unheard of for murderers to kill again once out of prison. I think in cases like these, the criminal should ever stay in prison until they die naturally or suffer a death penelty.
I say this because no matter how long some people spend in prison, they will NEVER be fit to live a normal life, they will still re offend. Why should we release someone from prison and give them a second chance at life when they are just going to go along and continue their crime and ruin yet another victims life.
Prison should be protecting the public from people like this, so it would be better if one way or another, the criminal never came out of prison.
Web Designer, Boxer, StreetFighter, Anime Collector and Gamer
http://kenjiharima.blogspot.com/
They killed the Amazing Elmo Live XD
ダメ人間, ひきこもり
death penalty is not really common in Indonesia, but around last month Am Rozi gang (some terrorist) just got death penalty by shot. I really think death penalty should be used more. heck lack of punishment just make crime rate increase!
Mad scientist
I was actually thinking about capital punishment today. I used to be against it because I was told at school that it's primitive to want revenge. This was told by the same teacher who told that somebody found a dead body in a swamp/marsh/wetland (not quite sure what to call that in English as none of those words fits 100%) and the police presumed it was a woman who had gone missing. They presumed her husband killed her and when they told him they found a body he confessed. To quote the teacher "later it was discovered that the body wasn't her, but now that poor man had confessed". Why should we feel sorry for him going to jail if he actually did it?
Now I'm old enough to think for myself and I changed my point of view. We shouldn't protect criminals, we should protect lawful citizens against criminals. All the human rights people are actually sacrificing lawful people by protecting the criminals. I presume that they don't realise that but it's the truth.
There is a guy here who went to jail for killing his mother. When he got out he moved in with his girlfriend and killed her and her children. Now he is in jail again but the law prevents us from keeping him forever and his profile tells us that it's highly likely that he wants to kill again. The problem almost solved itself because other inmates didn't like him killing innocent children so they attacked him and tried to kill him. The guards was barely able to stop that.
I don't see capital punishment as a way to save tax money. I see it as a way to prevent really dangerous people from escaping. A few years ago somebody escaped prison and he was on the front page of all newspapers and on TV all the time because he was a high danger killer. It would appear that he killed somebody with an axe just because he wanted to do so. It turned out that he was hiding somewhere and after 3 days without food or water, he was forced to leave to get something and the police got a zillion phonecalls and he was captured again. However the whole population was scared of this killer and this wouldn't have been the case if we would allow capital punishment.
A Real RocknRolla
no your whole point of view is wrong as you where wrong on a number of other things. ITS IS BARBARIC. human rights do not say let them go, or what ever. they say we stop treating them like animals or even less. we stoop to their level, we become what we condemned. less then human. we should feel sorry for him just because WE ARE HUMANS, we should try and help him, because WE ARE better then this!. and who are you to decide who gets to live? huh who the hell made us God on this world to decide such a thing? escaped you say? of course he escaped! wouldn't you after such treatment? i'm sorry to say your opinions are equivalent of a child or a very uneducated, with no sense of morality barbaric adult.
Student
I agree, we have to have higher moral standards than what we despise. How can we ever teach people not to kill, if we allow to kill criminals?
Mad scientist
I didn't say anything about how he was treated. The prisons have cabel TV and stuff, kind of like a hotel (no internet though). He escaped during a BBQ party for the inmates. His poor treatment with no food or water was because he was hiding outside the prison. They get plenty of good food in the prisons (in fact I think it's even better than what people on the outside usually eat).
If a dog kills a person, then the dog is put to sleep (or shot if it refuse being captured) because we know that if a dog kills once, odds are that it will kill again.
All though history (until very recently) killers have been hanged, beheaded or similar. The reason is simple: if they gave capital punishment to the killers, not only would it prevent the same killer from kill after he was captured, it would also scare other people from trying.
Recently some people got the idea of human rights. Basically it's a good idea and there is a lot of good stuff in the concept. However the people working for human rights think they need to protect the weak. The weak would be the people who risks being sent to jail by the state (like a state is evil by default). They completely forget about the victims of the crimes being committed.
I will give you an example of what I mean. A few days ago the humann rights court ruled that it's against the human rights for the police to know DNA of non-convicted people. A few years ago a girl was raped and killed. I think she was 7 or 9. The police discovered that the killer had entered a certain door, so all the men living in the apartments behind that door was naturally suspects. All of them except one would give a blood sample for DNA testing and the police arrested the guy who didn't want to give DNA and charged him so they could force a DNA sample. It turned out that it was him, but now it would appear that due to human rights all the other guys shouldn't give DNA since they aren't criminals... it would appear that it's better that the police had to arrest and charge all of them o_O
I have seen people using the "the political opponent is uneducated" argument before. It was used here about a political party and eventually somebody decided to make a survey to figure out if it's true that only uneducated people voted for that party. It turned out that it's actually the party with the highest procentage of high educated voters. It's also the party with the most company owners. The party who provided the claims turned out to be a magnet for uneducated people living on social security. Nobody have talked about the uneducated voters claim ever since.
In your case it misfired too. I'm getting a master degree next year. I think it's low to claim "agree with me or you are stupid and uneducated and fail to understand what this is about".
A Real RocknRolla
a golden cage is still a cage my friend. no its not low to say that cuz its true. it doesn't matter if your getting your masters, you can still be the biggest idiot on earth. if you don't mind me asking, what degree are you getting? and what your sugesting is to turn the world in to some sort of psycho police state. fine you want to live in such a country? go to North Korea. cuz i have lived in such a country and i will tell you crime was higher.
Office Administrator
http://aquilla429.co.uk
Does it matter what masters degree he/she is getting? Just because someone doesn't agree with your opinion doesn't make them wrong or childish or an idiot.
No one is right or wrong in this debate, because it's all personal opinion, it's nothing to get bent out of shape over. You don't agree with what they're saying, but that doesn't make you any more or less right then anyone else. No one is right or wrong on a topic like this.
Why is it so hard to have an opinion on the internet without being branded as a childish idiot just because someone doesn't agree with you?
A Real RocknRolla
actually it cost more to kill a person the to keep him alive, at least in the US what is a irony. true if the committed a crime such as mass murder people would say "an Eye for and Eye..." and in some cases yes they would deserver it. but what does that solve? you kill em, another will takes his place. rehabilitation is the key. plus other things to prevent the crimes it self like education for one and other programs to help people. when a prisoner comes to a prison he is treated like a animal. some say its justice i say its inhumane and you just become the same as the criminal when it comes to your mentality. a violent animal.
of course there are those who cannot be rehabilitated no matter how you try. still killing them is putting your self on the same level. as i said before, it cost more to kill a man then to keep him alive. i mean once they are in the prison they are not threat for society. so why kill them in the first place? to satisfy your own barbaric thirst for revenge? even if you do kill them, what has changed? is the effects of the crime gone? does it magically change history? no it will be the same as if he where alive, only in this case you become the same thing you condemned. no matter who you are who are you or as a whole society, deciding who gets to live and die is not for us to decide. taking ones life is never justified, that is playing God.
Consultant
I wholeheartedly agree with your sentiment. FACT: The cost of the appeals process for death penalty cases far outweigh the costs of incarcerating an individual for life. But, people do not seem to realize this.
Student/Music Producer/Web Designer
http://www.myspace.com/lionbiscuits
I don't have that much of an opinion on capital punishment...
I guess, if i really had to make a decision, I would say no, I really don't approve of it. While the dying is qiuick-- augh, I don't know what I'm talking about. Hanging just seems a little unnecessary.
Student
I'm quite shocked by most of the Comments here.
How can you justify killing a person, just by believing he did the same? There can't be an absolute proof of someone's guilt.
Examples from the USA show that the capital punishment can't be an instrument of justice, because many convicted who are sentenced to death, but are nut killed yet, are proven completely innocent. I guess they're pretty lucky... How would you feel, if you know you're innocent and have to die, just because you can't prove it.
I read many of you come from christian/catholic countries. Although I don't consider myself christian, I know that one of the main aspects of this and many other religions is repentence, which is basically called "prison" in our time. The suffering of killing someone and thinking about nothing else for many, many years is harder to bear, than dieing a short death.
There is just no ultimate certainty that the judges or the jury are always right. And sentencing somebody to death for carrying drugs or something like that is only proof that the governments of the countries are not (yet) able to control the crime without making themselves guilty.
I hope someone reads my comment, even if it's become pretty long...
A Real RocknRolla
most of em are kids and have no idea of somethings. or i have to say it, are just crazy Americans with their heads still stuck in their wester days.
It's not right to call someone childish just because they don't agree with you.
Mad scientist
You assume too much. Your description of people who disagrees with you like:
kids
childish
crazy Americans
uneducated
"have no idea of somethings"
I think I told already. When politicians start to talk like that, it backfires. I think you are not only missing the skill to have a discussion based on proper arguments, but you are also the one totally missing the point here. I hate to be the one telling you this but the "Old EU" has a serious crime issue with people coming from the "New EU". This means that we have gone from safe countries to somewhat unsafe countries where buglars kills people in their own homes and stuff like that. It shouldn't be a big surprise that the original population is against this development. Now you as one of the new guys tells us that we are childish because we want to "declare war on crime". This makes me wonder if you are just totally unaware of what goes on around you or if you benefit from crime.
Maybe this is a bit harsh words, but I don't think I have to talk as polite as I usually do after you call me all those things. Now you have to actually use some real arguments if you don't want this one to stick to you :P
CEO MIrai Inc
http://www.dannychoo.com/profile/eng/
Lets drop this thread.
Programmer
http://techsuki.net
Danny, did you pick yes or no in the poll? (just being curious)
Mad scientist
I couldn't agree more. I don't like decenting to this level. I apologize to Danny for saying stuff on his server that I guess I shouldn't have said.
It would actually be nice if we had some clear rules that outrules what started all this, which would be one guy calling a whole group of users... well no need to repeat. Basically I'm asking for a simple page saying something like "be nice to each other. No attacks on individuals, no namecalling" and so on so every time it happens, people can just say "you are breaking the rules" and it would stop threads like this before they even start where people get upset and says stuff they regret.
Programmer
http://techsuki.net
tymmur, is there any way I can contact you privately?
Mad scientist
I have a mail but somehow I got the feeling that if I write it here now, then I risk ending up in all sorts of mailinglists. I could mail you if you like (and I know where to mail).
I can't think of any reason why you would like to contact me privately though. I guess I will find out soon enough.
Programmer
http://techsuki.net
Follow the link to my website and use the contact form. I'd just like to talk to you regarding your opinion of this topic and about another older thread (to which I replied but I guess it was too old for you to notice). Nothing bad about it though, I just think it will be interesting sharing our views, but I don't wanna discuss them here for all to see.
Student
I hope Im being nice enough for your taste...
But why do you think crime rates are getting higher in the EU, especially in the old countries they are constantly dropping. And more importantly, the crimes like murder and such are becoming fewer and fewer.
And the reason why many European citizens are against the EU is because they want to keep the money from taxes for themselves and not invest in others. Now it's only natural if crime rates rise if a new country is integrated into the EU, but frankly, that proves our point!!
And just a quick comment about the insults here: Calling someone a child isn't as bad as telling someone he benefits from crime. And just that I'm clear: War ist not the answer!!! (even against crime...)
Student of the Finnish language and soon to be programmer?
http://www.fin-style.be/blog
Actually, I was typing my comment after I noticed yours. I pretty much agree with you. :)
Student of the Finnish language and soon to be programmer?
http://www.fin-style.be/blog
I'm against capital punishment. Who says you get the right to take another man's life? It only makes you as bad as the person which commited a crime. Lifelong enprisonment, without all the comfort prisoners get these days. This at least for people who killed another person or raped or inflicted mentally or physical damage.
There is absolutely no way to justify the use of capital punishment imho. And I'm surprised to see so many reactions, altought most of them are Americans, don't want to stereotype tho, which are for capital punishment.
Also in the case if someone is found to be guilty, but the person isn't, this person's life is taken for the wrong reasons. I'd rather have the money spent on a good trial and good research instead.
Afteral, a human has rights, even if he commited a crime.
Student
http://vegasmind.e3b.org/
I totally agree with you.
Student & Game Designer
http://www.artificialzeromedia.com/
kira is justice / would be
so yes, I approve
Student
http://bk201.wordpress.com/
Not in Australia... i don't think. But how many of these prisoners must Japan have to make them whine about their taxes =o
王オタク x 天才様
http://www.zakarius.com/
I'd say the death penalty is appropriate for:
Overwhelming evidence/witnesses - you saw the guy stab someone in front of you, photographs, DNA
Repeat offenders - people who just don't rehabilitate
Besides that, it's hard to be sure enough.
Delivery Driver | Semi-student
http://www.soulfringe.com/
I like to believe in reformation, and all that. But when you look at some of the worlds greatest serial killers, terroists, etc, there is no doubt that only death can be a valid punishment.
In conclusion, a person who can and does kill without remorse, should not be allowed to enjoy the thing he enjoys robbing of others.
Just my 2 cents.
Casshern - Student
In UK Capital punish ment is long gone we only have life sentences etc and our jails are over crowding so maybe we should bring it back.But i am against it what if we wrongly excusted someone and it was not him who did the crime.
Study
I firmly believe that no action you take, should be able to rob you of the most basic right, witch is the rigth to live and therefore im against capital punishment.
There are many ohter reasons to be against it, first off it is infact more expensive to excute a prisoner than sentence him to life in prison, theres always the problem that theres no way to go back if the guy was innocent and last but not least, people might actually make amense (im no religous though so maybe its not the appropiate word) while they are in prison.
It's also easy to say that rapist, child molesters and such deserves to die, since while they certainly are only counterproductive to society, i'd like to think that society is better than just killing them off.
In the words of Ghandi. "Eye for an eye, will make the whole world blind"
Fresh Diploma Grad... enlisted.. Cpl soon I hope...
http://splifearts.com
Let just do it the LaMB way then... no need for death but a fate worse then it... Your body is moving, you know it's moving, but you are not the one moving it... you are awake... and have no control, see someone you love, you cannot say... see someone you know die, you cannot cry... ...
that is the best way to kill a A-List Criminal... Kill their heart...
BTW, If you dunno wat's LaMB refer to Danny's post about a Blogging contest a few days earlier...
software engineer
I used to be for it, but now I am not sure. I don't know if another human being has the right to take away another human being's life away.
Sometimes you see criminals on the news, like child rapiest and murderers, and I think they deserve to die for their crimes. But can/should one human being take away another human being's life away?
on the other side, can you imagine having the job of taking people's lives away?
High school student
http://www.animeraku.com
I didn't know there's capital punishment in Japan.
In my opinion, capital punishment should be carried out in some cases. So, I'm for the death penalty. In Czech, the highest penalty is just the life sentence though.
People who won't stop killing others do exist, and they should be wiped out of the world in order to protect citizens. This means that somebody who murdered for the second time definitely deserves to die. You ask why? Because he already got his second chance, but he didn't reflect on his wrongdoings and did it again. And if you give him only some 10-year-sentence, he'll most likely kill somebody again once he's released from the prison. This is because it's rooted in his personality, and that's something you can't do anything about.
Otaku / Student in Networking
http://hayasaki-kun.blogspot.com/
Here, in Canada, we don't have death verdict anymore. But we do have in prison-for-life
Programmer Trainee
http://jointsareokay.blogspot.com
Define life
Sometimes a life sentence lasts until 7 years...at least that's what I heard
Game Designer & 2D Artist
http://catzstudio.blogspot.com/
Don't approve, I don't think any human, no matter what the reason, have the right to take the life of other human
Student, Uncle & hopfully a good husband..
Captial things...depends on the situation...and the person itself...Complex as humans...
Student, Uncle & hopfully a good husband..
Opps...sorry for the double post...i meant capital punishment...Don't know why i typed things...
Mad scientist
I see people are for and against capital punishment and use financial reasons for it. I think that's besides the point. The question is more like should we do the only thing that will for sure prevent a killer from killing again.
If we build a system where say 90% of the murders are solved and capital punishment isn't uncommon for cold blooded killers, then we would not only reduce the number of repeaters we would also scare away some potiential killers. The result is less random (innocent) people being killed.
So the question is: who do you want to live? It's damn hard if not impossible to get both even though that is what we all prefer.
A Real RocknRolla
yes but what does that make us? we become what we condemn. and if you lock someone up FOR life in prison how on earth will that man or woman be a threat to society outside of a prison? ok they might escape but thats because of lack of guards and prisons not being sufficient. plus such escapes are very rare and might be even impossible in the future since prison are getting more secure then ever before.
browsing the nets
http://otakuposts.blogspot.com/
difficult subject to comment on. maybe those prisoners should be brainwashed into becoming good citizens. IMO, a new method should be invented to give justice to the victims. we have to think for both sides not just say that the prisoner does not deserve to die because he took someones life or committed a barbaric act.
Mad scientist
I read that Canada has extensive research and treatment regarding criminals. They have a much higher rate of preventing repeaters. However they do get repeaters and they also discover that some of them is unaffected by their program. When I learned this, they only talked about sexual offenders. I'm not sure if anybody knows if it works on killers.
Also if we treat killers like this and they are set free once we presume that they will not kill again, then it will remove the preventive aspect of capital punishment. If somebody will not kill due to fear of capital punishment, but will kill and then get treatment, then even though we made sure that he will not kill again then he already killed one person that wouldn't have been killed if we would use capital punishment.
It's a tough issue, but I think it's needed in rare cases and that the rest of us suffers because it's not executed in those rare cases.
Interesting fact here. In the United States, the states of Utah and Idaho still offer the inmate the option of being executed by a firing squad. Most states use lethal injection, but i think the firing squad is a rather archaic way of going about it, yet i feel it has to be the cheapest method overall. The last man to die at a firing squad was in 1996 in Utah i do believe.
I'm don't think we should debate whether the use of executions is morally just or even required. Rather, we should be evaluating the conditions and causes that lead to crime to eliminate the motives. In this case it is money at the rrot of almost every crime even indirectly. Poverty is the most important variable to consider. People will do what they deem necessary to survive, so by keeping a permanent low class of society, a nation can profit from the continual prison state that exists under such conditions. It should be no surprise that my country has the largest prison population in the world. A closer look at the "drug war" reveals that this is another part of the rubix cube of social control over those in poverty. Isn't the world a fascinating place?
Student & Authorized Chicken Slapper
http://www.otakuinternational.com
three to five officers each press a button and one of them will cause death???
Wtf makes it sound a little sick like if they were doing it like a game show. I also find it kinda wrong that the person gets informed on the day they die and has no chance of a final meeting with their family.
I understand capital punishment is only given to the worst criminals but I myself cannot support it just because what if the guy ended up being innocent? I am sure it has happened in the past somewhere, where an innocent man was put to death and years later they find out he wasn't guilty after all. At least with life imprisonment there is a chance of redemption.
That is done so no man knows if he was the one who killed the prisoner. It is not some fancy game show idea, but a way to prevent a man from knowing if he was the one who killed the prisoner. The same idea is used in the firing squad. Only one man has a gun loaded, but 5 men line up to shoot, and none of them know who actually killed the prisoner. I'd imagine one could develop a guilty conscious from killing prisoners all the time, so it eases their minds a little i suspect.
Mad scientist
This is actually the idea. When Europe was controlled by kings, capital punishment was used in all kingdoms. The king's executer tend to be a well paid person because it was known that the person would end up feeling really bad about doing it and they end up drinking. I presume it was rare to find an execution where the guy with the axe was sober, at least it happened fairly often that they missed the neck because they were drunk.
Another method that has been used is to tie a house to some contraption and once the horse moved away by it's own free will, somebody would be hanged. This way no human did the actual killing.
NEET
I'm totally against Capital Punishment.
Even if the murderer is really evil I don't think he deserves Capital Punishment.
A long imprisonment is a better option.
Future College Student
I'm a new user here on Dannychoo but I've been a frequent visitor to this site and this is my first time posting... so nice to meet you guys!
Many of you seem to believe in this "eye for an eye" mentality... That if somebody kills somebody else that person deserves death...
Many of you also neglect to understand that "An eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind."
When is the circle of violence going to end?! A state approved murder just has a "Justice" label slapped on it therefore that makes it "Right" and "Just." So according to that murder is A-OK as long as a jury of your peers believes in it. At least thats how it is in America where I live.
Anyway violence just breeds more violence, crime breeds more crime. I personally believe in the saying "Locks only keep honost men out," meaning if somebody wants to seriously commit a crime it is going to happen regardless of capital punishment or not...
Just my two cents lol again nice to meet you guys
Mad scientist
I disagree and I think you missed the point (like so many other people arguing both for and against)
This is not about an "eye for and eye" or "An eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind."
Hundred of years ago, whenever somebody was found guilty of murder (at least in Europe), they were punished. One of the punishments were that in front of the whole town (by law, everybody had to show up) they got every bone in their arms and legs crushed. The spine was left intact because they had to be able to feel everything. They were then tied to a wheel with the arms and legs (remember without bones they are like rubber) and the wheel was placed on top of a spike. Now the whole town could see this person and hear him/her scream in pain while slowly dying.
Now the big question is: why? Is it cruel: yes. Is it inhumane: yes. Will it scare other people from committing a crime: YES!
Everybody who saw (and heard) this would be really scared of ending like that so the crimes that lead to this treatment was at a minimum.
I don't think we should do this again, but I'm saying that most of you forgot the factor that people will not commit the crime in the first place if they know they risk capital punishment. Ok, there are always weird people and then capital punishment will mean that they will not repeat murders.
Oh and welcome to DC. It's nice to see new people :)
A Real RocknRolla
no it wont scare anyone. the US is prof of that! crimes are rising even thou harsher punishments are given!
IT Crowd
I agree with Altair. If you really think on it, the threat of punishment is not going to prevent a serious crime such as murder. People will either think they won't get caught, or they act on their uncontrolled emotions, or they're actually (I'm guessing rarely) a sociopath.
As Altair has said in a previous post here (and I don't endorse everything he has said ^^), we need to look at the social problems in our society that are at the heart of so many crimes these days. What would stop me from committing a crime is my moral conscience, not the prescribed lawful punishment.
I believe we should care for our fellow-man and try to rehabilitate them, and unfortunately that will mean locking some of them up for the rest of their life, and I don't care if my taxes are spent on that. There's probably another debate to be had on the humanity of locking someone up for ever - but that's a whole new kettle of fish.
http://animaticfigmation.com/
I'm going to just say that I'm undecided. I don't want to join in the debate. I have my own personal opinions towards both ways but I can't make a full on decision.
Student
>Does your region carry out capital punishment and do you agree?
There is now capital punishment in Estonia. And I am not sure if this is a good or a bad thing. On the one side, someone has to pay to keep them alive, but on the other hand maybe life in prison is an even better punishment than relatively quick death...
Mad scientist
I have been thinking the same thing. I decided that this isn't about punishing a single person, it's about sending the signal about what will happen if a certain crime (in this case most likely murder) is committed. I presume that a fair amount of killers are psychopath. The worst fear of a psychopath is death (psychology told me that). If we can use this fear to make them NOT kill in the first place, wouldn't this be best solution? :)
BioResearch Assistant
You can be a killer and not be a psychopath. Emotion often trumps reasoning. A wife finds her husband in bed with another woman. Overcome by anger and betrayal she gets in a fight with her husband and throws him down the stairs and is charged with his death.
You speed down a street and hit a child crossing the street.
Manslaughter, pre-meditated, 1st degree, 2nd degree, 3rd degree, assisted...anything that ends the life of a human being as a result of your actions designates you as a killer.
A person can try and hide behind nomenclature all they want, skewed logic or even "alternative thinking" but the fact is they took a life.
For the most part psychopaths know they'll die for what they did, or have no comprehension of death and would not fear it but consider it a more "interesting" experience than life. To be driven to such an unstable state as dictated by society standard, they must have lived a life not worth living.
Is it not that people in general fear death the most? So psychopaths are like normal people in their fear of death, correct?
Who are we to use fear? Everyone has the capacity to take life.
To be honest, we are not part of the "we" that use fear. We are the ones who must be afraid.
Ask yourself, would you commit a horrible crime? If the answer is no and any part of the reason is that you don't want to be killed as punishment then I would say you got sent that signal.
Mad scientist
Nobody said that anybody who ends up killing somebody should recieve capital punishment.
We are talking about planned murders or murdering to steal the wallet and so on (yes this really happens). I guess we can presume that a fair amount of people killing like this are psychopaths.
I say you are asking a weird question as I wouldn't kill anybody even if I could be sure not to be punished for doing so. I presume that I would feel the guilt for the rest of my life. If everybody were like me then nobody would be murdered. It's too bad that this isn't the case and we have to deal with how the world is and now how we would prefer it to be.
Let me ask you a question. Think of this scenario:
Car A drives on a road and is speeding. Car B overtakes A and A gets upset because "nobody overtakes me". A harass B and eventually A forces B into a fatal accident at 100+ km/h.
Now how would you deal with the driver of car A, who did this on purpose?
This might sound obscene, but I didn't make it up. It really happened.
BioResearch Assistant
And I never said that as well. I was merely trying to establish that one cannot presume that "a fair amount of killers are psychopaths" as a person can be labeled a killer under any circumstance involving taking a like.
Sorry if you misunderstood that one.
Also, your definition of psychopath which you are implying is incorrect. A Psychopath is regarded as a person who is mentally and socially unstable, emotionally devoid, which leads to pleasure or gratification in partaking in disruptive and/or criminal behavior.
http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=what-psychopath-means
This doesn't follow in your presumption as most of the crimes are often gang/drug related or done in poorly developed societies with high poverty rates, hence a "crime of necessity" which is still wrong.
Ahh...and Driver A would be charged with voluntary manslaughter - intent to harm. It's road rage. I've seen many news reports and trial convictions of these to know what would happen.
It's, sad to say, a common problem here in the US. "Parking rage" is also on the rise as well...
Mad scientist
I think it looks like we are disagreeing more than we are. I didn't claim that all psychopaths are violent. I said that if a person is a murderer, then there is a fair chance that the person in question is a psychopath. Not quite the same.
About "crime of necessity". I used to think like that until I was told by a Thai woman that the crime in the poor parts of Thailand is not "crime of necessity", but it's a quick way to get rich. Those people can get what they need by working just like everybody else, but they learned that crime will give them more money for less work.
This made me thinking. Due to social security we have no poor people (ok, we have one group called students. They can't get social security meaning my income is 0 T.T ). Officially we have a few homeless, but it turns out that if you start to talk to the homeless they wil tell you where their apartments are... they just don't feel like being inside.
So if everybody can get enough food and a good place to live, cloth for all seasons and so on, we shouldn't have any crime. WRONG. However we know that the people committing crime either spent all of it on gambling or drugs or they have money like they won in lotto. Well, this is the case for most criminals being caught.
If we look at crimes where victims are physically hurt/killed then we have gangs and maniacs. The maniacs are people who kills or hurt people so badly that they will never recover just for the fun of it. They will do it over and over if not stopped and they are under the protection of some human rights fighters meaning we can't lock them up even though we know they will kill again.
Gangs fight to control the drug marked. They do this with drive by shootings and car bombs... stuff like that that can kill random people.
So would capital punishment work here. It would stop the maniacs from repeating their actions over and over. Will it stop them from doing it in the first place... good question.
The gangs might have a harder time recuiting if they could get killed by both police and other gangs. However you mentioned the best solution yourself. Capital punishment for drug possesion like in Singapore. This would remove most of the market for the gangs and if there is no money, there is nothing to fight for. It would also get rid of most breakings because those are to fund drug addictions.
BioResearch Assistant
I agree though it seems to be stemming from misunderstanding. An example of that being that I never stated that you are claiming all psychopaths are violent. Retracing my arguments I never made or implied that assumption. If I did, it was not with intent and most likely the cause of grammatical confusion.
If you could point out to where you assumed this I could make a clarification.
"if a person is a murderer, then there is a fair chance that the person in question is a psychopath."
I'm having trouble understanding the basis for this presumption as there is also an equally fair chance that they person is -not- a psychopath, and why you seem to focus on murderers and killers most likely being psychopathic (reference to the first and second reply on this comment chain).
That's what I'm trying to get at. I apologize for being assertive here.
And to make some clarifications.
Once that has been addressed my first comment addressed why you came to the conclusion that the worst fear of psychopaths is death when clearly defined - mental and emotional instability with a skewed sense of morals and right/wrong- is more indicative they are more likely to -not- fear death.
Moving along, in reference to your conversation with the Thai woman....how credible is she?
My mother says the exact same thing, though when put into context all of us have lived fairly good lives and have never experienced what it is like to live in poverty so it is easy to say such things without exactly knowing how hard.
While what she said is indeed true, it still doesn't encompass everything. Taking the current economic situation in the US, there are many homeless individuals and families. Some have to resort to theft just to get by. Yet, we can assume that all they need to do is find a job to get back up.
Looking at the financial market now, companies -need- to layoff/fire workers -instead- of hire them in order to stay afloat. How exactly are these people, growing in number as more and more lose jobs, supposed to find work when the demand for jobs is low?
Some may even lack the skills needed for the field where jobs are needed. The simple answer here is to study, yet where are they going to get the money for that when they can barely afford to live?
I'm not saying it's impossible to get back up, and that crimes committed because of need is justified but rather one should give the benefit of the doubt and that you cannot assume they do it to just "get rich" quickly.
So don't misunderstand the point I'm making here. I understand yours, just making an adjustment or rather including another aspect to that.
"If we look at crimes where victims are physically hurt/killed then we have gangs and maniacs."
Also not true. Your making too many generalizations here. I agree where you stand on maniacs, but not on your options where someone who commits a crime of injury/death is either involved in a gang or is a maniac as I have provided examples in my previous reply of crimes that counter that assumption.
[Take note you have moved onto "crimes where victims are physically hurt/killed" and not earlier of pre-meditated murders, etc....
And a crime is defined as a violation against public law so negligence, manslaughter, assault, etc...all fall under this.]
BioResearch Assistant
Just to clarify more, on this bit "and why you seem to focus on murderers and killers most likely being psychopathic (reference to the first and second reply on this comment chain)" I just want to hear your reasoning for the most part.
Chances are that we'll agree here but I just want to hear you out first so we don't have conflict later on in the event we don't agree.
Mad scientist
I think we should be more clear of what we mean and then we would agree a whole lot more. You are thinking US/globally while I think about my own backyard. It's questionable if the recession is a good or bad thing here. It's mainly bad, but it solves a huge problem, which is lack of workers. This means that some people lost their jobs, but most of them got a new job within a week. Social security will ensure that people who lost their jobs will not have to starve or sell their house. They might have to sell the car if they borrowed way too much but it's not common. This means that the recession shouldn't cause more crime out of need.
As for the Thai lady and how trustworthy she is... well knowing her I think she believe she is telling the truth. She was born in a "normal" family which in Thailand means they could use more money, but they didn't starve and she ended up a maid. Eventually she married her boss (now this should give you some funny ideas) which means she married money. Eventually she was sent to Europe where she lived in an expensive house, even by European standards (big house, view over a lake...) because the children should attend European private schools. Now you know her background so your guess is as good as mine if it's true.
While it could be interesting to know if it's true for Thailand, what I started thinking about is if it's true here and yes, nobody starves and everybody have a decent place to live, even on social security. This means that the only people who have a need to commit crime is the people with a gambling/drug debt to some gangster.
Maybe you presume that I generalize too much but it's actually the truth. When somebody is murdered here, then it's either somebody with mental issues or a gang member who did it. Sometimes it doesn't look like that at first but then it turns out that it's a gang member who was behind it anyway.
This shows what open borders can result in because most gangs are of forreign origin and before EU forced all member countries to open the borders mindlessly we didn't have this issue. 20 years ago we had close to no gangs and those we had wouldn't shoot each other on the street and hit random people like it happens now :(
University's Slave
No final meeting? And by freakin' hanging?! Jeez. Hanging went the way of the dodo here decades ago.
Capital punishment policies vary by state, but here it's lethal injection. I am against capital punishment myself--it's overly cruel, very hypocritical, and due to how fervently those sentenced to death appeal, it's actually more expensive than a life sentence! It makes no sense anymore. Oh, and another warped thing about US capital punishment: they won't execute a prisoner unless he's healthy. So, they end up spending tons of money to cure death row inmates with cancer, only to kill them. WTF, dude.
Polytechnic Junior, Bronze Lifesaving Trainee, Mech Designer In-training.
http://thehangerbay.wordpress.com/
Makes more sense if they sent the inmates to the hospital or something.
Mad scientist
Wouldn't that add a risk that the inmates might escape? They will have nothing to lose, so really high security is needed.
It seems wrong to cure somebody only to kill them afterwards. Not only is it a waste of money, it's also wasting time for doctors and the inmate would likely suffer (it's an open question if we want that though).
As for method of actually taking the life, I guess the aim is to make it as quick as possible. The one thing that comes to my mind is that there is a near 100% instant death in high voltage fatalities. If thte electric chair isn't working, then it's because it's designed for too low voltage/current (mainly current as that is the main killer once the voltage is high enough to get though the skin). I guess it isn't nice to clean up afterwards though.
Btw hanging isn't as long lasting as it used to be. Somebody figured out a way to make the rope break the neck to ensure a quick death. I think an injection takes longer to work.
BioResearch Assistant
As I see it, capital punishment only perpetuates a cycle of death and fear in society. Capital punishment is a scare tactic, to create horror in the minds of people that they would not ever think of committing a crime.
A memorable quote from the movie Swordfish.
"Terrorist states, Stanley. Someone must bring their war to them. They bomb a church, we bomb 10. They hijack a plane, we take out an airport. They execute American tourist, we tactically nuke an entire city. Our job is to make terrorism so horrific that is becomes unthinkable to attack Americans."
Proper logic?
As far as my view goes, I wouldn't want granted a welcomed punishment to a criminal who has done despicable crimes against my family and society.
Murderers who go on a spree of death already know they will die. It's a freedom, to escape their wretched lives. I'd rather they live that life for as long as they can in an even more wretched state. They took life to have their life taken, why give them that luxury?
Mad scientist
You talk about people going postal. I think we can all agree that we can't prevent this with any punishment system. We will likely not be able to prevent this with any system whatsoever :x
I see capital punishment more like a tool against planned killings, serial kilings and killings in organized crime. Is it the fear factor that should stop the killings, then I guess so be it.
Will non-criminal people be targeted of fear from this... maybe (I don't think so). Will people be scared of killers if there is one on the run around the area: most likely (specially if it's known that he has been in prison for murder). Now the question is: which one will cause the most fear?
Let me ask in another way: if you are in Japan, will you have a constant fear that you will be arrested and given capital punishment?
To be honest I would feel more safe on the streets of Japan than I am here, which goes against your argument about the fear factor since there is no capital punishment here.
BioResearch Assistant
"To be honest I would feel more safe on the streets of Japan than I am here, which goes against your argument about the fear factor since there is no capital punishment here."
Not exactly. You're separating fear and safety and not answering the argument I posed. If you lived in Japan you would feel safer yet at the same time you would not commit a crime because they have capital punishment. Another example: You wouldn't reside in Singapore with possession of a certain amount of drugs because that would incur the death penalty based on their law.
The simple answer is that no one would, or rather most people wouldn't. There's many factors, one of which is fear of punishment.
Why wouldn't the innocent have a reason to fear?
Your assuming you can judge a person as being innocent or guilty prior to them doing any type criminal action? Their innocence must be established first in order to say they won't be afraid.
Mad scientist
I think the safety factor and the fear factor are closely related. If the safety factor is low, then you will naturally get a high fear factor. My point is that my fear factor for lack of safety factor is far grater than fear factor for death penalty.
Drugs leads to crime and addicted people (with ruined lifes), not to mention they fund rebel armies in South America and Afganistan. I think Singapore has a nice law regarding this issue. I used to say jail everybody who had anything but I guess death penalty is better than nothing.
You bring up another issue. Will the system charge an innocent person. This is a major issue, but I'm not sure if death penalty or a lifetime in prison is the worst for an innocent person. The only way to completely avoid this is to not charge anybody. This would be the same as allowing criminal gangs to take control.
Office Administrator
http://aquilla429.co.uk
Lots of people are saying how it's wrong to kill anyone no matter what the reason and saying that a criminal still has human rights that need protecting.
In my opinion prisons should be protecting the public, they should be protecting the innocent, they should be protecting the victims. I really don't think every serious criminal (i.e rapists, child abusers, murderers, repeat offenders) deserves to die, but I also don't think they deserve to live a normal quality of life either, because they have ruined some peoples lives forever, those people can't get that back. So why should a criminal get his life back too?
I'm not for the death sentence, but why should I for example, as a person respect a criminals human rights when he obviously has no respect for other peoples human rights? Human rights should be a two way thing. If a criminal takes away someones basic human rights, then I think the criminal is undeserving of basic human rights.
Office Administrator
http://aquilla429.co.uk
Just to clarify, when I say a criminal deserves no human rights, I don't mean I think they should die.
What I mean is that they should live the rest of their life in prison, locked up and safe from preying on the public further. A life sentence to prison should be life, as in in there until the day the criminal naturally dies. None of this getting out after 30 years, or 20 on good behavior. Once the Judge passes sentence on the criminal, that word should be final.
BioResearch Assistant
How would you classify a normal quality of life? I've seen several prisons and been told the routine that they go through and it's amazing they can cope with that life until they die.
From my view, they aren't living a normal life....hardly. It's normal for them but for us it would be torture.
Office Administrator
http://aquilla429.co.uk
By normal quality of life, I mean they shouldn't get off easy and be let out of prison after serving their 30 year sentence (usually less here because they leave early on 'good behavior', which is a joke), then they can go on to live life normally in a flat or house with all mod cons, being able to go shopping, buy whatever food they like, wear whatever clothes they like, get a job or claim on benefit allowances and stuff like that. Living a normal like like everyone else, I don't think they deserve that luxury if they are a severe or repeat criminal.
Even if a prisoner can cope well with life inside, it still doesn't compare to 'normal living'.
BioResearch Assistant
Ahh, I see. It felt like you were trying to describe prisons as being normal living.
As jobs go...it would be hard but they would eventually find work. Convictions are permanent on a record and recruiters wouldn't exactly hire a convict.
I agree. I believe it was last year or so, two of child age - at the time - responsible for the murders of fellow classmates and a teacher were released after 10yrs or so in prison. They're in their late teens or early 20s and able to live their life. Despite being children at the time of their crimes, I personally feel they should live it out in maximum security until death.
Mad scientist
I think Raz is talking about US prisons while aquilla is talking about European prisons. Somebody in Europe got the idea that prisons should be like hotels. Apart from missing internet connection, they get better living conditions than students. They also have no living expenses at all meaning if they decide to work in the prison they will end up with more money when they leave than when they were jailed. Also depending on the type of crime, they can get "free time" from prison to do stuff outside the prison. I'm not kidding. Some guy was murdered while he was in prison for organized crime. However the murder happened on a parking lot and the prison said that it was ok for him to leave for an appointment if he were back before 5 O'clock or something.
This is so unlike how prisoners are treated in US prisons.
BioResearch Assistant
It seems the system is far too soft there.
Mad scientist
This is the point of view of everybody I talk to. However whenever a politician says something about stuff like ensuring that people in prison actually are in prison, then Amnesty International starts to yell up about the poor people in jail and their human rights and nothing happens. No politician wants to end up on the front page with a claim about being against human rights.
Office Administrator
http://aquilla429.co.uk
In our prisons in the UK, it varies slightly from prison to prison but most follow a similar pattern.
Prison wings usually have things like a communal tv, showers, pool table, ping pong table and a full canteen and seating area stuff like that, though not necessarily all in the same place XD. Most prisons also have gyms, libraries, places of worship for mixed religions, outdoor gardens and they even get free educational courses to study and achieve qualifications while inside. A lot of prisons also run activity clubs and such. I read once that to feed 1 prisoner for a day is about £2.
Prisons here aren't exactly a hell hole, but at the same time, people would still rather not be in them because it's still not homely or comfortable living. Also no matter how good the facilities are, other prisoners can always make it a horrible place because you get gangs and bullies in prison, so your fellow people can make it very hard living, not to mention corrupt prison officers can make life a living hell for some people.
So even though its not the worse place to be over here, its not exactly nice either, so living a life sentence until the day you die would still in my mind be punishment.
Student/ Future Doctor .
Criminals should die they only makes this world worst and keeping them in jails needs money food and room is that fair? here in this country if you kill you can get like 25 years in prison and even in prison they continue to commit crimes via cellphone or contacs , in my opinion when someone becomes a criminal of that size you loose your humanity and that thing about " they have human rights they need respect " well tell me they respected the person who they killed? the world would be much better with those people dead , the problem is that many people thinks that if you kill a criminal you become like him , i think that is more important the peace of a country or even the world that a thing like that.
besides don't you think that if you kill one criminal like that you are saving at least more than 3 or 4 people? killing criminals is not only killing is saving lives.
Student
http://andreijournal.blogspot.com
I approve but it really depends on the situation. Let's take the example of Danny said, three men with multiple robbery and murder, it's really a must to execute these kinds of people who just do something bad. If it's just a minimum crime act, maybe a mind torture would work so that the guilty would not do it again, like prisoning him or her. Sometimes when people are in jail, their mind breaks, and if fortunate, they get well and change into better.
Student
Didn't know Japan still had death sentence. In Canada, we don't have it, but I'm really on 2 sides on this matter. First, the sentences aren't long enough even when it's a life sentence, the prisoner as the right to get out of prison after 25 years... However, it costs a lot to keep them in prison and so I think death sentence would be one of the ways to get rid of those spendings.
Student
http://justobserving.wordpress.com/
Key point: Would YOU want to executed?
Mad scientist
Now what kind of question is that? (ok, it's an easy yes/no question, but still)
We could also ask "Would YOU want to be jailed?"
And then say if you said no to both questions then we should no longer jail killers either. It's just not how it works.
Office Administrator
http://aquilla429.co.uk
That judgment is flawed though because if that was the case, no one would be in prison either, after all, no one actually WANTS to go to prison, right?
Teacher, Artist, Writer
http://eatdrinkmanotaku.blogspot.com/
I believe that all relationships are reciprocal, and as such the taking of a human life in the first degree would be a willing forfeit of your own life. After all if you deny the right of your victim to continue living, what right do you have when the same comes to bite you in the ass?
College Freshmen
I agree with capital punishment, but there's the problem of a person being proved actually innocent later on. There was the one case of this guy who was in prison for 15 years only to be released or something like that. But I'm not sure I would like a hanging as the method of punishment.
Train driver
Wish we had it in the U.K. .As long as the evidence was conclusive, then i don't see a problem. Take a life, lose your life.
Professional Panhandler
http://theinfernoproject.com
Don't you think something is not working in the justice system when a lot of criminals are "repeat offenders"? They just go to prison, leave prison and they kill again. What happens after? Politicians play the blame game and nothing is solved. How many repeat murderers/rapists/scumbags do we need in this world? even more ridiculous is we have to pay for their freakin' sex change (heard this on the news earlier this year)? wtf kinda world are we living in?
In my opinion, the current justice system is too lineant to criminals/offenders. That's why there's cop killers out there because people don't fear the law anymore. I think capital punishment is a good deteriorant against crime. As for human rights...I would you lose your human rights when you kill/rape someone.
As for capital punishment in Canada, there isn't any unfortunately. I've heard on the news that they're planning on bringing it back on the federal level, but I doubt that'll happen as long as the government is chosen based on popularity votes.
Mechanical Engineering student
http://sabekujikaneda.multiply.com/
Yeah I agree with you on that one. Why even bother thinking the criminal's "human rights" if he himself didn't take into account the rights of his victim?
Mad scientist
I agree. It's like the human rights are more important for criminals than their victims.
As for laws and popularity votes. The problem is that everywhere there are people who votes but aren't really sure what they vote for or they think they vote for one thing and they actually vote for something else. Also it's unrealistic to thin that the whole polulation understands the consequences of all political decitions. I have a good example of this. There is a political party here who wants to discard all countries and turn EU into United States of Europe (this is their main objective). 1,5% (or something like that) of the people voting for that party think we should leave EU. Clearly those people failed to realise who they vote for.
I could go on, but I think I will just quote Platon (from memory) "Democracy is a poor type of government. However we use it because it's better than all the alternatives"
College Student
http://nategreene.wordpress.com/
Don't think we do hangings here in America anymore.
Polytechnic Junior, Bronze Lifesaving Trainee, Mech Designer In-training.
http://thehangerbay.wordpress.com/
Well, I suppose there's a difference between life imprisonment and the death penalty. It's not pretty, but the way some criminals act, it's the only option left.
anime junky :3
http://www.youtube.com/ThisGuyJohn
somewhat surprised it's still there, but i believe it should be used more often than letting murderous criminals rot and waste tax payer's money should just be killed in a painful way.
Missionary
http://suigeneris-me.blogspot.com/
in my opinion, a rope saves a bullet and several cc's of poison... and it's re-usable!
on the serious note, if you kill someone, in my opinion, you have surrendered all your "human rights". all your rights have died along with your victim(s).
Passing-Thru KamenRider
AFAIK no Capital Punishment in Victoria, Australia--can't say for the other states. Used to live in the Philippines, though, and it had both capital punishment and police that react like Bubba McGee Sheriffs of the Wild Wild West. IMHO, both countries have it wrong--Philippine National Police are either too hamfisted or else too triggerhappy (doesn't help that the PNP has a reputation for being crooks themselves). On the flipside, Australian cops are just way too nice.
I'd say that Capital Punishment should only be reserved for the most extreme cases, and only in cases wherein the verdict was Guilty BEYOND any reasonable doubt. Punishment must not only fit the crime, it should also be -Punishment-. You do not subject a petty thief to the same kind of punishment as a Serial Killer. I'm a strong proponent that a prison should NOT be comfortable, and that convicts must work to earn their food.
Most importantly, Capital Punishment is pretty much useless if the person you're putting on trial WANTS to die. Nothing else need be said.