Sun 2008/06/29 12:30
Hi all, I have a photography question here but am afraid to ask in photography forums for fear of being flamed for asking n00bish question so decided to try my luck here since the people here are nice and helpful. ^^; Ok, most of the time i take pics of my figures outdoor. sometimes against a scenery like the one above. As we know, figures are very small so i have to position my camera close to the figure or zoom in to make the figure look bigger. So the problem is, when I do that, if i focus on the figure, the background gets blurred (example), if i focus on the background, the figure gets blurred (example). The above shot of Haruhi was the best I can capture through trial and error. Any advice on this matter will be greatly appreciated. I have cookies. ^^; Oh btw my camera is the Nikon COOLPIX P5100 digital. Will a DSLR be easier to get the shot I want?
Posted on Sun 2008/06/29 12:30 by
i believe there is a technique call HDR (high definition range) photography i am not an expert, just that a couple of my frens likes to play with HDR first off, u need to take 3 pictures of different focus and exposure then they use a tool called photomatix to compile those 3 pictures into 1. tats it try goggling for this technique.. just told my fren that someone in dannychoo is asking, see if he is coming to explain..heheh
(ID #225018) Posted on 2008/06/29 12:43
here's a wiki http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_dynamic_range_imaging
(ID #225021) Posted on 2008/06/29 12:46
I think you need a DSLR camera or one that allow you store raw image to do that.
(ID #225023) Posted on 2008/06/29 12:50
hmmm i thought hdr is more for messing with the color and stuff rather than the focus. although, as i mention in my post below, i really don't know much about this stuff, so don't quote me. however, that's just the feeling i got reading some articles and looking at some pictures: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_dynamic_range_imaging http://www.flickr.com/photos/altus/2376600901/in/pool-japanhdr again, please correct me if if i've understood incorrectly ^^;
(ID #225024) Posted on 2008/06/29 12:54
Technical Writer/Editor, Designer, Collector, Artist, Nice Guy
Yeah, HDR is more about making composites of exposure and lighting and not focus. But ornehx's idea to make composites of multiple focuses is still a good idea to try.
(ID #225209) Posted on 2008/06/29 17:51
Troubleshooter, Universal Exports
That would be interesting to try. I have faked Depth of Field before with two photos...
(ID #225988) Posted on 2008/06/30 16:31
not sure when i'll have time for an outdoor review, but i'm also interested to hear someone's input on this. don't really know anything about photography so looking to learn whatever i can ^^; also, not to derail the conversation, but if anyone has any resources that would apply to figure photography, please share! ^_^
(ID #225019) Posted on 2008/06/29 12:44
I don't have a DSLR but I think you can manually control the focus with it. As for the picture, I wouldn't care if the whole build is in the picture because your main object is haruhi... well just my taste ^^;
(ID #225022) Posted on 2008/06/29 12:49
Hmm... I have never used your camera before, but do try this if your camera has the Aperture priority option(its often marked by a A). Increase aperture F number to get more details into your picture :-). I'm using a DSLR btw...
(ID #225026) Posted on 2008/06/29 12:55
Yep I just checked out your camera, it does have the Aperture priority option. Its the A at the MSAP options.
(ID #225031) Posted on 2008/06/29 13:02
TK-8316 / 宅男 Otaku / 工程师 Engineer
initially I thought that stands for AUTO. O_O
(ID #225063) Posted on 2008/06/29 13:43
Kitearch has it right. :) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depth_of_field
(ID #225033) Posted on 2008/06/29 13:06
thanks, learn something new... but my camera doesn't have that mode -_-
(ID #225340) Posted on 2008/06/29 21:58
Troubleshooter, Universal Exports
Good Kitearch answered one of my questions already. You can use Aperture Priority to set the camera's aperture larger -lower number like f/2 is large aperture and higher number like f/11 is small aperture- to increase the depth of field. Depth of field is the area where objects are in focus. When the aperture is large the depth of field is wide, so both Haruhi and the building are in focus. When the aperture is small depth of field is narrow and you get the results in your example photos. I like those photos by the way... If you want to experiment... A low ISO setting should also force the camera to increase the size of the aperture. You could also try a preset shooting mode like landscape since it will need a wide depth of field. I understand what you are saying about photography forums... There are user groups on flickr for your camera and flickr people usually are helpful and don't care how much or little one knows. http://www.flickr.com/search/groups/?w=all&q=COOLPIX+P5100&m=names Yes a DSLR will work best since you get greater control over aperture, shutter speed and ISO. You should be able to get good results with your P5100 too. Good luck! Let us know how things turn out gordon...
(ID #225057) Posted on 2008/06/29 13:33
TK-8316 / 宅男 Otaku / 工程师 Engineer
thanks edward, in my reply to Kitearch above, i thought the "A" means Auto. Silly me. "P" is the Auto. i will take your advice and go to the same location today to shoot, this time using "A" mode with the largest aperture my camera can produce, f2.7.
(ID #225100) Posted on 2008/06/29 14:30
Technical Writer/Editor, Designer, Collector, Artist, Nice Guy
Did Edward get it backwards? According to Wikipedia's "depth of field" (Faeber's link above), "reducing the aperture diameter (increasing the f-number) increases the DOF". So aperture should be set to smallest number (or f to largest number).
(ID #225197) Posted on 2008/06/29 17:41
TK-8316 / 宅男 Otaku / 工程师 Engineer
yup my bad. big aperture = small digits and small aperture = big digits can be confusing at times. so in this case i should use small aperture (big f-number)
(ID #225325) Posted on 2008/06/29 21:32
Troubleshooter, Universal Exports
Oh #@! I did screw that up. Sorry Gordon. Thanks for catching that xjaymanx. I shouldn't write comments so late in the day...
(ID #225935) Posted on 2008/06/30 15:21
yes this good advice. if you raise the f-stop you will increase your focal length. best advice is set your camera to manual and start experimenting. you'll figure out what everything does in time, and you can do a lot. personal i love using lower settings like f6 or 5 to get a way blurred out background.
(ID #225061) Posted on 2008/06/29 13:38
forgot to mention. SLR pwns. it's better any way you spin it.
(ID #225062) Posted on 2008/06/29 13:41
TK-8316 / 宅男 Otaku / 工程师 Engineer
yes i also prefer blurred background but in this case i'm catching the scenery so i need both the subject and background to be clear.
(ID #225065) Posted on 2008/06/29 13:47
it looks like you are using the aperture option. with a dslr, you can adjust the aperture, iso and shutter speed. i don't think that would work on a point-and-shoot camera. just remember this: 1. who or what is your object of focus. 2. apply the rule of thirds or single dominance whenever shooting. 3. always make use of the camera settings for the desired outcome. 4. always read camera manual before doing anything else. i just simplified it hehehe
(ID #225073) Posted on 2008/06/29 13:54
Designer
Hold your horses, gordon!!!! Err... the higher the number (for example f11 or f22) will have far & near things clearer all together... the smaller the number will have nearer things clear and further things blurred.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depth_of_field
(ID #225126) Posted on 2008/06/29 15:41
TK-8316 / 宅男 Otaku / 工程师 Engineer
NOTED! ^^
(ID #225332) Posted on 2008/06/29 21:42
Troubleshooter, Universal Exports
Remember that simply put depth of field is the area where objects are in focus. With the right aperture and focus on a far object one can blur out the foreground.
(ID #225940) Posted on 2008/06/30 15:26
Otaku-Lolikon-Student
take pciture without focusing lolz. btw, the blur background is enable the object u took to standout of all thing. its not like u go to vacation and you wanna show off the background =
(ID #225139) Posted on 2008/06/29 15:56
TRY decrease the aperture i think around 18 is enough...maybe most of case.. if the aperture is too big like....5.4/so then it will become blur on the background.. u need to adjust the focus on manual... and try as much as u can focus on all (tha bacground and the figure..) it will be blur at first but...the result will diferent after u take a shot... if it's not focus enough...try decrease the aperture again.... the problem is the shutter speed will become slower and it's better to use a tripod in this case.. i hope this will help u! gbu!! http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2004359&l=f8bcd&id=1042423288
(ID #225155) Posted on 2008/06/29 16:18
Well, if you are out in broad daylight the smaller aperture won't really increase the shutter speed by that much.
(ID #225508) Posted on 2008/06/30 02:29
If your digicam has the ability to set aperture priority, then use it. The higher the better, but I recommend using a tripod as the shutter speed might take seconds. For best flexibility, get a DSLR.
(ID #225156) Posted on 2008/06/29 16:19
I just got a Canon Rebel Xti, it's a DSLR. I've been taking few pictures of my figure close up, and the back ground is always blurred if I get too close. If I focus into the background then the object will get blurry. Nothing on camaera you can do. Now the HDRI people are talking about is interesting I should try that. One dumb way to do this, is take same picture with different focus then photoshop it lol
(ID #225227) Posted on 2008/06/29 18:19
Troubleshooter, Universal Exports
You can do it. Just remember you need to take control of the camera. In other words, take it out of auto. No offense, but this has to do with f stop and not the camera.
(ID #225951) Posted on 2008/06/30 15:34
TK-8316 / 宅男 Otaku / 工程师 Engineer
ok guys, so with your advices, i went back to the same location and took a shoot using a small aperture. this result is below. http://gordonator.files.wordpress.com/2008/06/haruhi03.jpg the background is clear and haruhi although a bit blur but definitely much improvement over the previous shot in my example.
(ID #225330) Posted on 2008/06/29 21:38
Did your camera focus on Haruhi or the background? Seems like it was focused on the BG.
(ID #225507) Posted on 2008/06/30 02:28
TK-8316 / 宅男 Otaku / 工程师 Engineer
focus on background. if i focus on haruhi, background will be blurred. :-(
(ID #225543) Posted on 2008/06/30 03:22
Troubleshooter, Universal Exports
Maybe focus on an object between the background and Haruhi might help. Did this happen in other photos you took? silentkey has a good point about focus problems. That building is almost like glass and doesn't offer much contrast so your camera could be having trouble. Then again with F2.7 being the largest aperture you will need to get Haruhi closer to the background. Sorry...
(ID #225979) Posted on 2008/06/30 16:20
TK-8316 / 宅男 Otaku / 工程师 Engineer
wait. shouldn't i use a small aperture instead of 2.7 a large aperture? the furthest i can get haruhi away from the camera is an arm's length since i need to hold her with my hand.
(ID #226240) Posted on 2008/06/30 23:55
using a lower F/bigger aperture sure makes the background more focus but I think only slightly, CMIIW? I would like to know if there is any other technique to make the back and fore ground focus. is there any lenses that can solve it?
(ID #225376) Posted on 2008/06/29 23:43
I had this problem...i think it only applies to non-DSLR...had no such problem when i used a 400D...you should have a portrait mode..use it and it should clear up...If that doesn't work...go get the lens for the camera...A wide angle lens could solve the problem...both figure and background should be clear...but positioning yourself is important...zooming ruins the shot with the lens....Last tip...position your figurine in a better light...it helps the camera to focus...on what you want....
(ID #225472) Posted on 2008/06/30 01:44
Troubleshooter, Universal Exports
That is the problem with point and shoot. The camera is always trying to make up for what it perceives to be the desire result. Sometimes experimenting with preset modes and one can trick the camera. I can get my newer PowerShot to do behave with a little work. That is the fun of photography, trying to overcome the limitations of equipment. Quite true, human zoom is always the best when possible. Question... Do you have a Depth of Field preview on the 400D? Both my 20D and 5D have it. Sometimes it is handy to allow the camera to show you how things will look before I take the photo.
(ID #225968) Posted on 2008/06/30 15:59
As in Live View mode? The 400D doesn't have it though the newer 450D has this feature.
(ID #226026) Posted on 2008/06/30 17:25
Sorry for dub-posting...if you wanna meet up...do mail me...email is in my profile....
(ID #225475) Posted on 2008/06/30 01:46
There's a technique here on this site. Really useful http://www.cambridgeincolour.com/techniques_depth-of-field.htm
(ID #225504) Posted on 2008/06/30 02:25
ok, after asking arround here's a way to get a focus on fore and background by using a combination of DOF enlargement technique we can achieve a focus fore and back ground. first is by using a bigger F number such as F11 and above, bigger F number increases the DOF. but not enough to make fore and back ground focus. second, try using a wide lens which has a larger DOF than normal and tele lenses. by combining these 2 techniques I think it's possible to achieve the desired photo results... *haven't tried it yet, no wide lens, pls tell me if it worked or it didn't...thx...
(ID #228191) Posted on 2008/07/03 01:39
where do you stare at first on this Elwing figure? me, it is the eyes ^^;
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