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English/英語  Sat 04/21 00:47 JST
この完成品MGストライクフリーダムは現在ヤフーオクで50000円で買えます。できはなかなかかっこいいのだが、個人的にはガンプラというのは自分で作るから楽しい。ワンフェスなどで完成品ガンプラをてごろな価格で見たことはありますが、なんだか他人が作ったガンプラを買うのは違和感感じます。みんなさんはどう思いますか?
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syrix in U.S.
student
登録日: 2007/03/21 09:18
I agree with you Danny.  It's not the same when you don't build it yourself.  It gives you a sort of satisfaction that you made it yourself with your own hands.
(ID #46817) Posted on 2007/04/21 02:41
Gerbera04g in New York City
Art Student
登録日: 2006/12/26 02:34
I wouldn't mind buying one, that's IF I had the money. I think I went through a phase of purchasing tons of model kits and ruining all of them because I was horrible when it came to assembling. Right there was a couple of hundred spent on kits and supplies. 

Hey, one could always buy a completed model and say they built it to their friends and family, haha. I'm kidding. 

(ID #46818) Posted on 2007/04/21 02:52
Rei in Sydney, Aust.
Uni Student
登録日: 2007/01/23 15:50
Thats rather overpriced for a finished gundam. I agree, wouldn't buy a gunpla kit if its finished by another unknown. Rather enjoy self satisfaction that you've spent 5000yen and built something from your own hands than 50,000yen (10times as much) from someone else when you could maybe just present it as nice as they did.
(ID #46819) Posted on 2007/04/21 02:55
bolt in Tampa Fl.
security/student
登録日: 2007/04/17 14:41
never in a million years will i buy another mans model..
only other options are toys and figures 
(ID #46820) Posted on 2007/04/21 03:01
Ken in NYC
Student
登録日: 2007/03/15 22:26
I might buy a model that has been assembled by some person that just got tired of it. Then I'll go do the mod's myself without having to put it together. Gunpla depends on the price. 50,000 yen is NOT reasonable at all. Sell it for $100 and I'll consider it. In fact, that picture doesn't look any better than what's on the box. 

BTW, the auction link doesn't work
(ID #46824) Posted on 2007/04/21 03:10
Ken in NYC
Student
登録日: 2007/03/15 22:26
nm, it works afterall.

There are still better works though.
(ID #46825) Posted on 2007/04/21 03:16
V1lt R in US
Honda technician, baby.
登録日: 2007/01/05 13:10
I think this just inspired to start a business selling assembled model cars.
(ID #46826) Posted on 2007/04/21 03:33
Trent in Minnesota
Otaku
登録日: 2007/02/10 15:01
Ugh...I would never buy a completed model kit. For me, a model kit is all about seeing if I can do better then the last Model kit I assembled. Expecially for 500 bucks!!! I would rather buy a few kits or a ton of Fix Figurations or something...On a different note, I hate the design of this model. Freedom Gundam is one of my favorite gundams, and I think design gives a bad name to Freedom Gundam. I can't stand the gold joints!!!
(ID #46828) Posted on 2007/04/21 03:36
登録日: 2007/01/01 14:00
Again, this is related to my "Xyzpdq's 50 year Model Plan" ^^.


I would not buy a model kit for that much for display purposes. The kit is nicely done, but no matter how bad my Gundam kits look (I think they look decent to above average) The most fun is found in building the kit and understanding the intricate parts (or do I say that because I am an engineer? ^^).


If this were my model kit I was selling, I would take the cost of materials and the kit, set the reserve there and see where the bidding goes. Any extra money I make off the auction will go to people who need it! (Not to mention I get the money back to build MORE kits.)


For $500 USD that is a bit crude, I would price it at about $200. Then again, the value of this thing is determined by the seller, and ultimatly the buyer who may purchase the model. Nice Freedom Gunpla btw =) I like it (hate the series, like the model).
(ID #46829) Posted on 2007/04/21 03:56
thegeek in Northern California, United States
Geek Liaison
登録日: 2007/03/26 06:18
I could see paying that if it were some rare limited edition only 200 made type thing, but just for a standard kit that some guy put together I don't think so. I mean come on for 500 bucks I could buy two Gundams a couple of nice Garage kits and still have a few bucks left over.
(ID #46830) Posted on 2007/04/21 03:57
That's a modified MG Strike Freedom though.  It's not the same as the one you buy.  And if you think that's expensive, check out the Strike Freedom  on the link above.  It sold for over $11,000 USD.  It does seem ridiculous to most people, but personally I don't think its any different from people paying millions for a painting.  Some people have unusual hobbies with deep pockets to go along with it... nothing wrong with that.
(ID #46831) Posted on 2007/04/21 04:12
V2 in manila, philippnes
bodegero
登録日: 2007/01/08 23:06
i'd get them if i were in the same status as donald trump... owning such an expensive kit really bugs me since i wont be able to treat it like a toy (by posing/reposing it many times) in which if you do, something will definitely break...
(ID #46832) Posted on 2007/04/21 04:15
Alafista OTAKU in Singapore
Psychology Maverick
登録日: 2006/12/25 11:22
I would agree on you with that. I think if I buy it, I would take it for granted and over time I would just neglect it and leave it lying there to collect dust.

But then ... I suck at building gunpla. Thats why I buy fix figuration. Hmm .. buying a constructed gunpla and buying a fix figuration seems to the same thing don't you think.
(ID #46834) Posted on 2007/04/21 04:29
Frost in Philippines
Project Team Lead
登録日: 2007/01/09 16:30
The one Losttek posted is Keita's Evolved Strike Freedom.

If it was from Wonder Excellence and I had cash, I'd actually consider buying it. You should check out his works. They're pretty awesome. His mods aren't the cheesy, I'll-kill-you-all-upgrade-ftw kind.
(ID #46835) Posted on 2007/04/21 05:26
Dave in oregon, usa
That model doesn't even look that nice. Also I agree, the fun with model making is making the models look good for yourself.
(ID #46836) Posted on 2007/04/21 05:44
BeLe in Davao, Philippines
.NET/Web Developer
登録日: 2007/01/03 16:24
I wouldn't buy one no matter how good it looked.  That would simply take the fun out of making these gundam models. :D
(ID #46837) Posted on 2007/04/21 06:26
otaku nenny in Victorville, CA
Office Administrator
登録日: 2007/03/22 11:53
I could not see myself paying for a built gundam.  I enjoy taking the time to build it myself (no matter how messed up I may make it).  The true satisfaction of a gundam model is that YOU completed it.  
(ID #46838) Posted on 2007/04/21 06:58
Dan in Alberta, Canada
Broad question.... what about Gundam FIX Figuration? Those are already built  gundams.... 

I'm not really planning to buy an already fix one 'cuz just like the others, i enjoy building them no matter how terrible it looks in the end.
(ID #46840) Posted on 2007/04/21 07:54
Piecemakr in Southern California
Student
登録日: 2007/02/10 15:01
I would buy one if they were cheaper. I don't want to invest the time to build my own but don't want to invest the money on a pre-made one. In any case the FF metal composite RX-78-2 is good enough for me.
(ID #46841) Posted on 2007/04/21 07:59
becky lee of KNC in pasadena, sokal
webmistress/ ceo
登録日: 2007/03/17 11:07
i have no confidence is building anything... especially a strike freedom gundam... i would pay for it pre made... just so i can make all the other geeks jealous ^^
(ID #46842) Posted on 2007/04/21 08:30
kaito kun in Hong Kong
student
登録日: 2007/06/11 16:19
although people build nicer dan me i still like buildin it mah self, experimentin stuff lol well not on de expensive stuff!
(ID #46843) Posted on 2007/04/21 09:12
The-O in California, USA
Building Gundam models has always been a hobby since I was little. As I got older my skills improved as well my finished Gundams. Even if I was to purchase a complete Gundam, I can't take any pride in the techniques and work that took to make it. 
(ID #46844) Posted on 2007/04/21 09:14
CyberSynaptic in Northern California
Nursing Student
登録日: 2006/12/25 18:58
I wouldn't really ever buy an already made Gunpla, but if it was a super limited edition static figure of my favorite Gundam, and it was sculpted by a master sculptor in a dynamic pose that you couldn't pull off with Gunpla, and I had the cash to spare...then yeah I would.  That would be the same as buying an art piece at a gallery or something.  I'm not very good at gunpla myself, but I do agree with the rest that all the fun is in building it yourself.  Though I don't agree with everyone in that if it turns out looking crappy...it just feels like a waste of money to me (as a couple of my hideous first tries at Gunpla are hidden away in their nice boxes).  I'm actually doing a "serious" gunplay build for the first time (meaning custom paintjob, panel lining, the whole schabang).  I've got a 1/144 HG Murasame in the planning stages (still figuring out the color scheme, and waiting for HLJ to send it out to me), and if it turns out halfway decent, I may post some pics on Figure.fm.
(ID #46845) Posted on 2007/04/21 09:30
belizeanvibes in Houston
Intern Architect
登録日: 2007/03/26 22:57
The whole reason I buy Gunplas is because I enjoy building them. So buying a built Gunpla to me defeats its purpose. However I do sell Gunplas that I built as I run out of shelf space. And they usually fetch a pretty good price!
(ID #46849) Posted on 2007/04/21 14:37
Gordon Pekeur in south africa -cape town-
I agree with U Danny, a GunPla kit should be enjoyed FULLY!! Assembly, Painting and modding, if U are on a "DEMON LEVEL" in modelling ....
(ID #46850) Posted on 2007/04/21 15:14
Digger
Yeah...agree wif you guys that it's the building process that provides the satisfaction. Aniway, duno if dis is the right place to ask dis but I'm heading to Japan n passing dis rinku outlet with dis Bandai Asobi shop. anyone heard of it?
(ID #46851) Posted on 2007/04/21 15:37
SG in UK
Art/Media Student (Wannabe Illustrator)
登録日: 2006/12/28 05:27
Well, its a tough choice for the buyer but probably a good choice for the seller.

The seller would probably sell it for the materials used, skills and time spent making it. (Thats where most of the profit come out from I guess, skill & time).

Much like Keita, he sells his kits after finishing, all is left is the pictures that he took as a memory.

If I was to sell off a nice finished kit, I would find it hard to depart from it lol.
(ID #46852) Posted on 2007/04/21 16:24
OMNI Strike in Glasgow, UK
In my last year of High School
登録日: 2006/12/25 02:12
most of the fun of gunpla is making the model yourself. I had so much fun making my PG strike. Just sat there for the whole day just after i got my exam results. SUch a good day. I wouldn't mind buying a completed one, but it would have to be a really, really , really good one with great detail.
(ID #46853) Posted on 2007/04/21 18:37
N3w_Typ3 in Tiny dot in the world Map
Well I Build gunpla but more concentration in Tanks, planes and resin figures.

Well if one could afford a pre build Gunpla, why not. 

To me not everyone have the time to enjoy building and some people only want to look at it...
Hahaa...

I heard from a friend of mine.
He has been selling tanks on E bay,
and one of the tanks he build for was also a modeler who build planes...

This plane modeler said, I can build very nice planes but I cannot build tanks..., it is just the different skills put together...
(ID #46854) Posted on 2007/04/21 18:45
piya in USA-CT
Retail - it suxx
登録日: 2007/01/02 02:55
My skill at building model isn't all that great, i get by.  it is fun doing it your self but sometime i don't have the time or the skill to finish a model with good detail so in that case i wouldn't mind buying one.  
(ID #46855) Posted on 2007/04/21 18:59
Hachiko in Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Student
登録日: 2006/12/26 11:01
i agree, buying gundams that are prebuilt is just bad. you just feel the guilt that you did not build it! when you build the gundam you feel proud that you completed it ^^
(ID #46856) Posted on 2007/04/21 20:06
Gorgo in Florence, Italy
Games addicted
登録日: 2007/04/16 18:44
Buy a finished G.model? No way...
Have all that colored pices set all around the room, is like beign stop in the time ^^. And my wife? That get sooo mad for that? Totally priceless ^^!!
Seriously, for me is like to have a mission, and a very important one. Build something so little and so amazing that will be mine forever...

Bye to all!

.:G:.
(ID #46857) Posted on 2007/04/21 20:27
Hayden in London, UK
Custom Pc Builder, Night Sniper
登録日: 2007/01/06 05:41
It should be made illegal to sell 'pre-made' gunpla.

the main part of gunpla is knowing that you spent loads of cash on it, & spent forever building it, so you can truely be proud of what you spent your tie & hard earned cash on.

whats the point of 'pre-mades' if the whole experience is down to building it yourself?

I dispise anyone who dares perchase a 'pre-made' because you wont know the true meaning of gunpla & chases are if you dont then you bought it purely for looks, that you can show it off to all your little buddies when they come around so they can give you that little more respect so they might kiss your feet.

If Mr T were right next to me now...

I sure he'd say:

"I pity the fool who cant build his own gunpla...."

If youve lost both use of your arms then by all means go ahead & buy a pre-made gunpla. only if your that disabled wil it be truely justifyable to buy a pre-made.

Be proud of your gunpla, not a poser.
(ID #46859) Posted on 2007/04/21 20:48
X-Gear in his room
College student
登録日: 2007/01/18 16:48
The whole point of a model kit is building it.  I wanna waste my day or 2 on a model kit.  It special by putting your skills on it ^-^ sound like a nerd
(ID #46860) Posted on 2007/04/21 21:21
SG in UK
Art/Media Student (Wannabe Illustrator)
登録日: 2006/12/28 05:27
Would anyone here sell their own masterpiece Gunpla here?
(once sanded, remodelled and painted)

A MG Gunpla can be built within a day, for me, its up 2 hrs and plus another 1hr to sand and paint.

I like building my gundam so much that both of my mg mods is taking 1yrs lol...
(ID #46862) Posted on 2007/04/21 21:50
IvanHoeHo in Waterloo/Toronto
IvanHoeHo in Waterloo, Canada
Student
登録日: 2007/04/21 07:25
hey Danny,

I can't find your email address, so I'm posting it here...

I haven't been able to see comments ever since the last website overhaul. I thought maybe there's an option or something that makes it show up, but guess not... Then I used IE(6) instead and all seems to be well again. I'm not sure whether it's a plug-in conflict or what(using latest Firefox 2), but I just wanted you to know.
(ID #46864) Posted on 2007/04/21 22:38
Danny Choo in Tokyo
Director/代表取締役
登録日: 2006/12/11 10:54
IvanHoeHo,
Thanks for the headsup - I think I fixed it. LMK.

Dan,
GFF are produced from the beginning as a completed model so I feel its OK to buy them.

Losttek,
Nice find and crazy price!
(ID #46869) Posted on 2007/04/22 01:35
IvanHoeHo in Waterloo, Canada
Student
登録日: 2007/04/21 07:25
Yup, works now :)

Thanks alot, man
(ID #46877) Posted on 2007/04/22 03:50
Zeon Daikun in Virginia, USA
dude all i get is a lil' dog pic.
(ID #46878) Posted on 2007/04/22 04:26
penpen in Providence, RI, US
apple store slave
登録日: 2007/01/12 14:12
umm i like the guy under me says, dude the link goes a pic of a lil dog, cute yes, but i cant read what the hell he's saying, for all i know he's calling my mom a whore..... u never know?
(ID #46888) Posted on 2007/04/22 07:56
Zeroblade in Manila, Philippines
Student
登録日: 2007/04/10 21:35
Not really interested in the whole GunPla thing; it'd be cool to display that in my room though.
(ID #46897) Posted on 2007/04/22 14:33
krazypercy
never should i buy built gunpla...
as you would say it perfectly...
you should enjoy craftsmanshift not emptying your pocket with others mishalf...
(ID #46903) Posted on 2007/04/22 18:36
Norman in Philippines
Data Analysts
登録日: 2007/02/11 00:09
500 USD?! Phew! I'd rather buy
a PS3 unit for that.
(ID #46904) Posted on 2007/04/22 18:38
Shasui in Norwich
I would build my own thank you very much


mind you I do Warhammer and thats just as fun
(ID #47032) Posted on 2007/04/25 18:38
archaznable30 in Philippines
Webdesigner/Email Support
登録日: 2007/01/20 12:21
@Norman 

yah your right I would dish out for a PS3 instead of an overpriced Gunpla. But I would rather buy unbuild ones over those already build. 
(ID #47106) Posted on 2007/04/27 15:57
Trent in Minnesota
Otaku
登録日: 2007/02/10 15:01
I din't know where to post this, but since it's the most recent Gundam post, and I really feel like saying it I will. I was doing some Gundam models this weekend, and i have decided; TESTORS MODEL PAINT IS THE WORST PAINT IN THE WORLD!!! I ruins your models. By far Tamiya color is the best paint on the market, whether it's spray or little jars. BUY TAMIYA!!! YAY!
(ID #47201) Posted on 2007/04/30 16:29
GodHand in Indonesia
Graphic Designer
登録日: 2007/05/14 06:52
That MG Strike Freedom costs 500 USD? No way.
But 500 USD for the MG Strike Freedom made by Keita from Mesarion? Hmmm....

http://f7.aaa.livedoor.jp/~mesarion/gallery/evolvestrikefreedom/evolvestrikefreedom.htm
(ID #48415) Posted on 2007/05/24 03:49
gundammad in Yorkshire, UK.
Peddler of Gunpla
登録日: 2007/05/24 00:44
I have a large Gunpla collection and I have considered paying a prefessional model builder to build me up and finish a nice PG Gundam kit. As I'm sad to say I tend to just build mine up and give them a minor touch up with paint pens and panel liners...
(ID #48456) Posted on 2007/05/24 14:29
bk in Mauritius
Graphic Designer
登録日: 2007/06/04 16:47
Agreed definitely!!
all the fun resides in building the model!!
I would rather buy a fix figurative instead of buying a wholly made kit by someone else!
$500 way too much!
(ID #49115) Posted on 2007/06/05 08:59
kenny in australia sydney
No way! the fun bit about gundam models r building it not let someone do it 4 u. 
登録日: 2007/06/07 04:13
I would disagree. If you like kitbashing like me or like modding from different kits, its a lot cheaper to buy pre-snapped-together kits off the internet and use them to bash with the kits you have. It actually saves you money.
I made a MG destiny a year ago, I bought a freedom frame off ebay for $25 and a destiny kit for $20...
both of which are cheaper...simply because they were prebuilt...its all to the degree of plamo i suppose.

similarly...some people want gundams just for display...and lack the skills, perhaps resources to make it themselves.
(ID #58964) Posted on 2007/10/09 22:27
Wave Rider in NJ United States
Student/Daemonhunter
登録日: 2007/01/22 05:57
No would be the answer to a normal gunpla. 


However, I have seen the Bandai complete versions floating around on eBay. Those would actually be worth the money, but for the most part, I would only buy that so I can show off the fact that this is made by professionals.



As I've said earlier, I'd never buy normal completed Gunpla, since: 

"I have no interest in ordinary completed Gunpla!" 
(ID #173080) Posted on 2008/04/21 07:28
skankywonders in California
Student
登録日: 2007/08/09 05:24
Takling about finished gunpla... Anyone know where I can get some finished/completed gunpla? 

I know I know, this is a dishonor or whatever...
(ID #173081) Posted on 2008/04/21 07:31
Barsona in California USA
NEET (no, student...)
登録日: 2007/08/03 08:24
the fun thing about gunpla or model making is the fact that you make it yourself.
(ID #173092) Posted on 2008/04/21 07:58
sammyb in Berkeley, CA, USA
Student
登録日: 2008/04/06 04:46
Definitely agree with you. lol theres a heated argument on this topic in the Genshiken manga-
Kasukabe:so models are basically toys, right?
Tanaka:You have to build models yourself.
Kasukabe:so they're worse than toys.
Tanaka:there's no way I can let that one slide.
XD
(ID #173162) Posted on 2008/04/21 10:34
kintaro in Pineville North Carolina
Student
登録日: 2007/04/24 20:07
I wholeheartedly agree with you. I've bought many gunpla over the years and I've had loads of fun building them. While majority of them aren't really display worthy, it was still worth my money.
(ID #173172) Posted on 2008/04/21 10:48
Starboykb in Brunei
IT TechGuy
登録日: 2007/05/15 23:53
I think building your own Gundam is the best and fun. nomatter how bad it look, we can learn to improved it our self.

I will never folk out 500 USD to purchase somebody gunpla.
(ID #173188) Posted on 2008/04/21 11:31
radical anime fan in UNR-002 M House-Comp Powered.
Polytechnic Student, Freshly Entered.
登録日: 2007/01/25 21:08
I just saw three of each comment on this page O_O no wonder it was so long.

No, I wouldn't buy pre-made gunpla. Sort of defeats the purpose, doesn't it?
(ID #173189) Posted on 2008/04/21 11:31
gordon in 新加坡 Singapore
宅男 Otaku/ 工程师 Engineer
登録日: 2007/06/11 14:45
MG strike freedom is my favourite gundam kit. it was vited best kit of 2006 as well. ^^

anyway although doing a MG gundam kit might take a long time, i enjoy the whole building process. panel lining, spraying, top-coat etc.  
(ID #173202) Posted on 2008/04/21 12:27
Sotb in Malaysia
Manufacturing
登録日: 2007/08/22 12:17
me myself is a gunpla maniac! I has lots of them still in their box! 
But i feel really wrong for tat MG to be placed at tat price! The works on the kit aint good enough to deserve tat price! I hardly see any mod on it and also it is just the original painting only!

I know of greater moddeler works tat look greater than it and the price wont reach 500usd the max will only cost around 200usd! For that amount of detail!
(ID #173211) Posted on 2008/04/21 13:08
MobiusOne in Vancouver
登録日: 2008/01/22 15:30
what's the fun in buying a completed model =p...building the whole thing from beginning to end is the best part!! 
(ID #173218) Posted on 2008/04/21 13:21
CaTZ in Indonesia
Game Designer & 2D Artist
登録日: 2007/02/10 15:01
for that price, all the golden parts better be made in at least 22k gold :lol:
(ID #173238) Posted on 2008/04/21 13:49
登録日: 2008/04/20 19:30
我非常喜欢  高达



北京和上海  有很多高达店



手办 我本人也非常喜欢看高达seed 和高达00
(ID #173289) Posted on 2008/04/21 16:03
CrazyAnimeTuga in Portugal
Student
登録日: 2007/01/03 02:00
Well I got a friend that owns a shop and he makes gunpla and other plamos for his customers because they say that they don't know how to make them. WTF?! Just follow the instructions and if you screw up thats one lesson you learn
(ID #173294) Posted on 2008/04/21 16:32
Kyori in Hell in Heaven
Designer
登録日: 2008/04/21 17:48
After viewing the pictures in the auction page, I don't think this work actually worth that much. the paintjob is bad plus the decals are done badly, you can actually see that a whole piece of it pasted there. 
For properly done decals, you can only see the texts/pictures without seeing the whole "border" of the cutout decal.
Wonderexcellence gonna feel bad if he knows such bad job can fetch as high price as his. lol
(ID #173323) Posted on 2008/04/21 17:55
Gundam Otaku in Tropical Singapore
Student
登録日: 2006/12/30 22:04
Couldn't agree more with you Danny. What matters most is the satisfaction from the end product^^
(ID #173356) Posted on 2008/04/21 20:44
GundamJehutyKai in Foundation II Stellvia
IT Client Support
登録日: 2007/09/12 21:21
WTF??? It's barely modded!! Paint job is a little iffy in places too.
I prefer my own colour scheme tho...

Normally, I'd agree with the "buy to build" mentality but some are so awesome that i wouldn't mind ponying up the cash if I had it to buy one.

Like the 1/100 MG Akatsuki mod I saw years ago which used the MG strike gundam as a base. You could barely recognise it by the end! 
(ID #173363) Posted on 2008/04/21 21:02
[Enigma] in Singapore
Student
登録日: 2008/02/26 18:59
lol.. wat for buy a completed gunpla? wheres the fun in that? the only reason why i buy gunpla is to have fun fixing it.. and to waste time too of course... but that really depends on your definition of waste. err... yea...u get the idea... lol buy gunpla to fix! lol
(ID #173372) Posted on 2008/04/21 21:28
Ricky in Brisbane, Australia
Pharmacist
登録日: 2007/03/28 18:14
Haven't you made a post like this before?  Or was it Dejavu?
(ID #173415) Posted on 2008/04/21 22:59
yumeno in Singapore
Student
登録日: 2007/10/22 14:37
Completing your own gunpla gives you a sense of achievement, no matter how good or bad you made it =/
(ID #173424) Posted on 2008/04/21 23:20
4g1t0r1 in somewhere in this crazy world
student
登録日: 2008/04/08 04:47
there are no fun to buy something already build I feel the same danny
(ID #173454) Posted on 2008/04/22 01:03
gurugurutrex in Vancouver, B.C., Canada
オタク by moonlight, Graphic Designer by daylight
登録日: 2007/11/08 03:25
not a fan of gunpla anymore but for sure I won't buy something had been built already. =/
(ID #173507) Posted on 2008/04/22 04:20
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